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clocodile
Preferred Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2010
Posts: 314
Thu Feb 25, 2010 12:00 am
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ENJ,
Totally disagree. There is no other place people can say these things and have people respond with sanity instead of a panicky fear.
There is a theory that those who threaten do not suicide but that has proven to be an old wives tale. However, while they are writing here and threatening they live. Right? So by allowing them to write here we help them live at least a little longer and allow the person to hopefully get through the crisis and maybe even get some good advice from members.
If you just remove their post I say it would drive them towards suicide as everyone has rejected them. Let's not go there huh?
Suicidal thoughts cause us to want to suicide and saying it out loud often makes it seem unreal or even ridiculous. You see no one can stop someone who wants to so if they are saying it out loud they are actually testing their own reaction as well as others.
Certainly there are those who do it regularly, on other forums I've been on, many such people, and they never actually do it. Talking to them doesn't achieve a thing, they just want a little attention and end up getting it from people exactly like them. Weep and wail together. If it helps them that's fine but I don't have to respond to that type of repetetive behavoiur.
But the one off crisis threat must be accepted and responded to else what are we here for? Nothing. |
enjoimx
Junior Member
Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Posts: 39
Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:04 am
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In clinical pyschology, there is an ethical obligation to take suicide threats seriously.
When a counselor hears talk of suicide, she comforts and advises.
When a counselor hears suicide threats, she calls the police.
Anythying short would be negligent.
Maybe you guys dont see the distinction? |
Joobles
MVP
Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 461
Location: slightly round the bend
Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:27 am
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Clearly we're all stupid. |
mr.mental
Full Member
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 144
Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:29 am
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We're not councilors enjoimx! This is an anonymous forum where we post how we feel. That's it.
Don't you see that?
If someone is threatening to kill themselves. Then it is up to their families or those around them to intervene. It is neither our right or place to do that for them, and banning them would worsen the situation.
You have obviously never felt suicidal?
Well I have. And at that moment of the lowest hour, you just want to know that someone in the world cares and understands what you're going through.
It might seem like a straightforward threat to you, but sometimes the threat is just a disguise in order to get someone to listen and understand. The words "I will kill myself" draws more attention than "sometimes I think about dying." It's a shock tactic, that they hope will draw in help.
There's only so much we can do as a forum, and only so much influence we can have on a poster. The rest is out of our hands. We can not be responsible for everyone out there in the world. And no one expects us to be. We must ALL accept responsibilty for ourselves, and for us that means, ensuring our advice and concern is helpful and supportive.
Enough said. I'm not going to say anymore. If you're that stubborn - I'm not going to convince you otherwise anyway. |
mr.mental
Full Member
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 144
Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:44 am
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Oh and just to add. If the families and the people around them cannot see that these people have been acting strange or depressed for months on end. Or they refuse to see it. Then that's their fault.
I don't think they would have the hide in the end, to go blame some forum, who actually took the time to respond as helpfully as they could.
If you don't like it - then maybe you should stay away from these kinds of posts? That's just a suggestion. Then maybe you can stay nice and cozy up there on your "moral high ground"?
But best wishes, in any case. |
clocodile
Preferred Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2010
Posts: 314
Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:04 am
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Enj,
Someone on this thread said "We are all professionals". It may have been you. Actually, we are not.
You say you used to counsel which indicates you don't now. SO, not professional. I used to counsel and so on too. But I don't now, just write on these forums.
I wasn't sure why that was said but it seems you have attached yourself to some responsibility tied to a real job of face to face suicide counselling. And by the way the first action is NOT to call the Police. It is to seek hospital intervention. If the person is remote to where you are then Police, yes.
Nobody here has responsibility for anyone else's life but if we ban suicide threats what next? Do we ban those who say they are thinking suicide? Do we ban people who mention meds and stockpiling?
It would seem to me you are uncomfortable with such threats so why do you not just leave those posts to those that can and will deal with them. Isn't that how we deal with posts here? Only answer those we think we can do something for or about? You don't answer every post do you? |
enjoimx
Junior Member
Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Posts: 39
Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:29 am
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quote:
Originally posted by clocodile
Enj,
Someone on this thread said "We are all professionals". It may have been you. Actually, we are not.
You say you used to counsel which indicates you don't now. SO, not professional. I used to counsel and so on too. But I don't now, just write on these forums.
I wasn't sure why that was said but it seems you have attached yourself to some responsibility tied to a real job of face to face suicide counselling. And by the way the first action is NOT to call the Police. It is to seek hospital intervention. If the person is remote to where you are then Police, yes.
Nobody here has responsibility for anyone else's life but if we ban suicide threats what next? Do we ban those who say they are thinking suicide? Do we ban people who mention meds and stockpiling?
It would seem to me you are uncomfortable with such threats so why do you not just leave those posts to those that can and will deal with them. Isn't that how we deal with posts here? Only answer those we think we can do something for or about? You don't answer every post do you?
No no no. I never said that. Please read and try to understand the important distinction i am making.
Im not uncomfortable with such threats at all. Its just negligent for a website to host them.
You guys are still missing my distinction, so I will try to spell it out yet again.
I think Uncommounforum SHOULD allow posts that TALK about suicide. Ok? That is FINE.
Should, should should...do you get that? Suicide posts are OK!!!!!! Please understand that.
I think they should NOT host posts where people give a date and or method in which they plan on killing themselves, unless their is some person willing to monitor all of the posts and call professionals when someone threatens to KILL THEMSELVES. That is called a threat, and it is exponentially more serious than someone saying they are having suicidal feelings. |
Joobles
MVP
Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 461
Location: slightly round the bend
Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:20 am
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Considering you used to be a counsellor you have an amazing ability to put peoples backs up and insult their intelligence - intentionally or not. It's not a great advert for the professionals you are so keen on.
We need to respect that no one is always right, just because you think something doesn't automatically mean it is correct. Others have opinions too and it is only right that you respect that. Talking at people like they're imbeciles because they don't agree with you is quite unfair. People do get what you mean, they just don't agree with you. Saying it over and over again isn't going to change that. |
Chick1979
Preferred Member
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 543
Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:22 am
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quote:
Originally posted by enjoimx
You guys are still missing my distinction, so I will try to spell it out yet again.
.
Nope, not missing the distinction. We just don't agree with you! |
briary
Moderator
Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 10838
Location: East Sussex
Thu Feb 25, 2010 12:28 pm
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quote:
Originally posted by enjoimx
In clinical pyschology, there is an ethical obligation to take suicide threats seriously.
When a counselor hears talk of suicide, she comforts and advises.
When a counselor hears suicide threats, she calls the police.
Anythying short would be negligent.
Maybe you guys dont see the distinction?
I think perhaps you don't see the distinction. This is an anonymous forum not a clinicaly psychology clinic or therapy session. Even we wanted to inform someone that a poster has threatened suicide we cannot do that because everyone is anonymous
If even one person finds comfort here, posts and finds that being listened to helps get them through thoughts of suicide then surely it is better they have somewhere to express their feelings rather than being turned away?
No post will be removed unless it breaks forum rules and the site is moderated, but talk of suicide is not a breach of the rules.
Karen |
Windyday
Full Member
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 296
Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:14 pm
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[quote="enjoimx"] quote:
Originally posted by clocodile
Enj,
I think they should NOT host posts where people give a date and or method in which they plan on killing themselves, unless their is some person willing to monitor all of the posts and call professionals when someone threatens to KILL THEMSELVES. That is called a threat, and it is exponentially more serious than someone saying they are having suicidal feelings.
I agree with this. In my book there is a big distinction between talking about suicide and posting method and/or date.
Windyday |
romank
Full Member
Joined: 16 Feb 2009
Posts: 121
Sat Apr 10, 2010 9:18 pm
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Give me all your money or I blow my head right now! I'm gonna do it, I am telling you!
That might actually work with some gentle souls out there. I hope no muggers read this forum, I don't want to give them ideas. |
questionking
Junior Member
Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 90
Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:20 am
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| Re: Should suicide threats be allowed? |
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quote:
Originally posted by enjoimx
Being a past counselor of college students in a clinical setting, I propose banning suicide-threat posts on this forum. By allowing this kind of post, we arent helping anyone from killing themselves, we are simply giving people a forum to indulge in negative thinking and possibly reinforce ideas of suicide.
It is highly innapropriate and dangerous for untrained people to try to "talk someone out of killing themselves." It is also neggligent on behalf of the website to allow this behaviour.
Anybody who works for a health or counseling center will tell you that when someone threatens to kill themselves and has a date or method, the only appropriate response is to call 911 and allow professionals to deal with the situation.
Its one thing to say "I am feeling suicidal I need help" and another entirely to say "I am going to kill myself, try and stop me" in a forum such as this.
We are not professionals here and are not equipped to handle suicide threats. I can't belive this type of post is allowed.
There should be a sticky post on the top that clearly indicates resources for suicidal people to call for immediate help by professionals.[/b]
[Edited by Admin: 'SHOUTING' removed]
i completly agree... an innocent person just trying to help should not have the thought that they may have been at fault for the ending of a life... people should ask for help instead of trying to poke people to say "no dont do it" |
Rebekah Bean Curley
Junior Member
Joined: 02 Apr 2010
Posts: 68
Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:14 pm
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| HEY! read uppppp; |
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May i first say, i personally dislike so called "professionals" just for stating that they are in fact "professionals"..
In my opinion, no one is a professional, other that those who have been through the situation - or disorder in this case.
If your mum/daughter/bestfriend/whatever texts or calls you at 3 in the morning saying they're about to end they're life. YEAH, you're gunna say "shut the **** up and get back to sleep" aren't you?
NO! would you HELL! death is serious, and you'd with common sense help ANYONE who even feels like they want to die.
It's just morally correct to help someone in need.
You must show them the point of life, no matter if there is none to you.
There is a point of a life and everyone's opinion on it is different 
Anyway, the point i'm stressing is that you can't make people shut up when they're crying out for help.
Because suicide is basically a cry out for help.
They want to be heard, to seen, to helped.
The don't want people saying "get a grip" they don't want to moan about how they feel, they just want to make you understand by possibly saying they're gunna kill themselves.
-ALSO, the only reason i'm still here posting on this forum, is that i have this new family to help me.
Yeah, i don't keep in touch as much as i'd like to, but they're always here, and you can come on here knowing that you can get help and provide help too.
I love this forum, and the small-ish group on here that help each other on the smallest and biggest problems they have in life.
It helps, a hell of a lot
I think if you're really a "professional", you should know all this by now, and if not, get off this forum, or just read up about personal experiences, because if you don't understand, then you frankly have no right to run your mouth talking about what people can and can't do..
Thanks, x |
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