Can a book help?

#15

Postby quietvoice » Wed May 10, 2017 12:16 am

FallenMelek wrote:. . . and here he comes judging me for wanting to have kids and telling me that I'm immature? . . .

And he's right, based upon the information you had provided us in your opening post.

Your life situation isn't conducive to raising a psychologically healthy child at this time.

Slow down; there's no rush.
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#16

Postby quietvoice » Wed May 10, 2017 12:53 am

quietvoice wrote:Slow down; there's no rush.

Well, gosh, I just saw that you're about 34 years of age.

Explain what you can see happening should you get pregnant.
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#17

Postby FallenMelek » Wed May 10, 2017 8:21 am

Listen, other people's stupidity/ lack of logic is what usually makes me angry. Now, about 90% of the time I can keep my mouth shut and cool off before my anger hits the boiling point where I DON'T WANT to control it anymore. Other 10% I just let it out. I am happiest when I don't have to deal with any disrespect. It is really hard for me to accept the reality that most of the poeple you meet these days are mean, very mean. Maybe I am living in the wrong community (I am actually 98% sure of that. I live in Midwest, and while I was in west coast for example I was 10x happier person). Maybe it has to do with my past in which people have seriously disappointed me, so I don't trust them anymore, and all my anger and hate towards them is actually result of unconscious fear I have of getting hurt again. I am at a point in life in which I am trying to realize what causes my anger and how to properly act upon it.
I want to be a Mom because I want to; I want to give life and raise my kid better than my parents raised me, I want to leave a better part of me in this world after I leave it. Now whether I stay close to my current source of anger which is my husband (and I repeat it is only on rare occasions- like once in a year, mostly in spring), or I remove myself away from it- that is up to me, I am sure I will be able to realize that once I figure out if I will be able to get rid of the anger or not.

I still don't understand why is everybody so focused on me having a kid instead on helping me. I will say this again: I was only looking to find out whether any of the books on anger out there will be able to help me understand some things and show me the ways on how to better act when emotuons hit me. That's all.
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#18

Postby Leo Volont » Wed May 10, 2017 11:16 am

FallenMelek wrote:Actually, my head is not spinning at all. And weirdly, I didn't feel as angry as much as I felt offended by That Richard's remarks. I came here to seek help, thinking I'd find people who would be able to help, and I opened myself up like never before, and here he comes judging me for wanting to have kids and telling me that I'm immature? That is offensive, in my mind at least. Well, after his second reply I found it amusing actually, because no matter what- he wouldn't let go. What is that if not crazily stubborn? (considering that I haven't been looking for advice in that particular area at all).
I just came to find out if the book would help, you gave me the answer. I bought it 15 min after I read your post, and I just got back home from work, and the book waited for me at the front door, so we'll see. I'll give it a go.
Thank you for your advice once again.
And really? You should not be fishing like that for angry people... Somebody might get really p***ed off.


Hi Fallen,

Oh, Which Book did you get. I talked about "The Angry Brain" by Ronald Potter-Efron, but he has written many books.

but whichever book you have, will help.

Oh, and about Richard (and Quiet Voice seems to have latched on too). Sure, he wouldn't Let Go. Remember, Richard may just be testing you. and consider, that from his point of view, YOU wouldn't "let go" either, which would mean simply that you didn't show the Anger Management Good Sense to Walk Away, to 'blow him off' and stop responding back. He would have admired you if you simply shut him off.

It is interesting that your head was not Swirling with Ideas and emotions. you seem to remain calm, focused and intent when you get into a combative discussion. I don't know whether that is good or bad. If it does not disturb your Peace of Mind, then it can't be All Bad. But I am wondering about whether you LIKE these Confrontations. You seem used to Them -- being Calm Focused and Intent sort of shows that you are Accustomed to Confrontational Argumentation. You know there is such a thing as Predatory Angry People. they do not get flustered like ordinary Angry People. Their style is more to make deliberate attacks and provocations so that they can enjoy the Reactions of their Victims. anyway, I hope you do not actually enjoy these Confrontations with people. that would not be a good sign.

Few of the Anger Management Books cover this one Detail, but I've thought about it a lot. that is concerning Anger, Irritability and Social Acceptance. We might expand that to a Tendency toward Confrontation and Debate. People, for the most part, do not like it. Quarrelling against other people's Opinions raises a lot of Red Flags in people's minds. On the Job it might hurt your chances of Advancement, or even give the Bosses the notion they should look for a reason to fire you. Yes, yes, we all have a Right to Speak our Minds, but remember that Silence is Golden. People love Good Listeners, and tend to shy away from People who can discourse, even competently, about every way that Other People are Wrong. (you can imagine how I had to learn to Keep my Opinions to myself.)

so there are Reasons you are already aware of for controlling your Anger. But once you begin to really get into it, you will find that it is All Bigger than you at first thought, and that you had Problems you weren't even aware of. .

Oh, yes, I heard what you said about how you only Blow Up only once or twice a Year. You know, I was the same way. but one or two times a year is Much Too Often in this Touchy World we live in. I am an Old Man, and can remember back in the Twentieth Century _ The Good Ol Days -- people were allowed to get Angry and "blow off steam'. No one ever got fired for it. Even Social Groups were rather Resilient regarding Tantrums and Scenes. People would come together and work out ways to facilitate reconciliations. Nowadays, there is almost Zero Tolerance.
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#19

Postby FallenMelek » Wed May 10, 2017 2:27 pm

I did get "The Angry Brain" by Ronald Potter-Efron. I have finals this week, so i managed to go through only 30 pages last night. I already knew about 90% of everything that I've read so far.

I actually don't like confrontations of any kind. I really don't like arguing with anybody, and I'd much rather get out and have a cup of coffee and a pleasant conversation. However, I find a lot of people weird, because everybody thinks only they are right and nobody else, and they will do everything they can to convince you. Also, I really am having issues with my husband because he never accepted me for who I am- an honest person. He's always wanted me to be able to fake certain emotions or to say opposite if what I actually think just to avoid possibly offending somebody. I can't lie and deceive people about who I am because it is not morally right thing to do. I am who I am and why would I want to change for anybody but myself? Am I selfish? I don't know... Maybe I am. In all honesty, neither lying nor deceiving is acceptable means of communication with other people (in my mind). Maybe I was born in wrong age. Maybe I should have been born a 100 yrs ago when everybody was a little bit more honest.
I am truly suffering because of all this.
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#20

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed May 10, 2017 3:17 pm

FallenMelek wrote: Also, I really am having issues with my husband because he never accepted me for who I am- an honest person. He's always wanted me to be able to fake certain emotions or to say opposite if what I actually think just to avoid possibly offending somebody. I can't lie and deceive people about who I am because it is not morally right thing to do.


Does the above sound like a relationship ready for a child? Is it the morally right thing to do?

Maybe I should have been born a 100 yrs ago when everybody was a little bit more honest.
I am truly suffering because of all this.


How about trying to be more honest with yourself? You are feeling many pressures including that of wanting a child, so regardless of your mental state or the poor state of your relationship, try to get pregnant? Is that what you consider being honest with yourself? It doesn't sound very honest to me, it sounds like you just want to shut out the true state of your relationship, do whatever you want and then label it as "honesty".
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#21

Postby FallenMelek » Wed May 10, 2017 4:17 pm

:) Here we go again...
Bye Richard. Have a goid day.
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#22

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed May 10, 2017 4:57 pm

You too FallenMelek, have a good day as well.
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#23

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed May 10, 2017 5:06 pm

FallenMelek wrote:...never accepted me for who I am- an honest person.....to say opposite if what I actually think just to avoid possibly offending somebody. Maybe I should have been born a 100 yrs ago when everybody was a little bit more honest.


One other thought....

You want me to say the opposite of what I'm thinking in order not to possibly offend you? You want to live in an environment where people are more honest, yet I'm being honest with you and you react by burying your head in the sand. I think you have some double standard where you can say whatever you like, but others are not afforded such rights.
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#24

Postby Leo Volont » Thu May 11, 2017 10:20 am

FallenMelek wrote:I did get "The Angry Brain" by Ronald Potter-Efron. I have finals this week, so i managed to go through only 30 pages last night. I already knew about 90% of everything that I've read so far.

I actually don't like confrontations of any kind. I really don't like arguing with anybody, and I'd much rather get out and have a cup of coffee and a pleasant conversation. However, I find a lot of people weird, because everybody thinks only they are right and nobody else, and they will do everything they can to convince you. Also, I really am having issues with my husband because he never accepted me for who I am- an honest person. He's always wanted me to be able to fake certain emotions or to say opposite if what I actually think just to avoid possibly offending somebody. I can't lie and deceive people about who I am because it is not morally right thing to do. I am who I am and why would I want to change for anybody but myself? Am I selfish? I don't know... Maybe I am. In all honesty, neither lying nor deceiving is acceptable means of communication with other people (in my mind). Maybe I was born in wrong age. Maybe I should have been born a 100 yrs ago when everybody was a little bit more honest.
I am truly suffering because of all this.


Hi Fallen,

Wow! I noticed that as soon as you "Nice Day"'d Richard, he politely let you go. I KNEW that was what he was waiting for.

Oh, it is SO GOOD to hear that you do not LIKE these quarrels you get into.

Oh, about BEING ONES SELF. the Problem there is that We are Not Fixed and Locked Down. Situations and New Perspectives often do a lot to Change Us. Now, YES, I certainly would never advise anybody to CHANGE FOR The Worse. But often People resist Changing For the Better.

Keep reading that Angry Brain Book. the Personality, over Time and through Intensive Work is malleable. Certain Complexes can be Atrophied by None Use. Other Complexes can be built up by Practice and Repetition.

For instance, when I first went into my Nation's Army, I was not mentally, emotionally or behaviorally what you would call a Solder. but after a few Re-Ups I had quite the military bearing. I mostly worked in the Offices, and so I developed clerical and People "Skills" that had not existed in me before. But of course you can see such examples everywhere. For instance, career salesmen and lawyers grow more obnoxious by the year. Customer Service People after a decade on the job become unflappable- customers can no longer upset them, and they are invariably calm and polite, well, the good ones -- the ones that become Supervisors. Oh, and then there are Married Men. a man that has been married longer than 10 years has a look and a behavior... all women can see it, and once a Man is aware of it, he can see it in his fellows. It is a kind of Beaten Down and Subjected look. It happens for all the Giving In and Compromising the Husbands have to do to keep their wives happy, or rather, to keep them from so much complaining. But ALL of the Examples show Personality Development through Conditioning. Nobody has some Fixed and Constant SELF.

So, Fallen, understand that your Husband may only be wishing that you Stretch and Try new things socially, with the understanding that once you try something you might not find it all so terrible. I think it is a dead-end to tell him that You Can Only Be Yourself. You can tell him that such behavior is Beneath your Conceptions of an Ideal Person, and you are trying to be Ideal, or tell him that it takes A Lot of Practice to do what he Suggests, that is, to act Differently, and that you might try your best, but can't guarantee anything. Once you Put your Viewpoint into the Realm of Ideals, then your Husband will have the avenue of trying to persuade you that he THINKS he is recommending an Ideal. You know, your husband may not be wrong about everything. think about his Requests, and whether he is asking you to do anything absolutely Wrong or shamefully embarrassing.

Men are also sometimes very stubborn about Being themselves. For instance, some Men say that they are Not the Dancing Type. But one man in a hundred will go to one of those Dance Studios and pick up a few steps, and find that he has fun dancing at the Clubs just like the girls. and some Men are NOT Cat People. But when thrown together with a cat, they find their resistance breaking down, and start seeing the Thing as a Little Friend.

I myself have been working on my Personality. I am an Old Man but still have some years left, I hope. and I would like to spend them as a More Ideal Personality. Do I have to spend my whole life being a "Working Class Kid" with a semi-dysfunctional upbringing. I've read books. I've seen Movies. There are Personality Characteristics that I admire. so what is to stop me from Picking them Up. Just like playing a New Musical Instrument -- it takes a while to get used to it, but after a while it Seems to come Naturally.

So, Fallen, in short, don't use the Concept of Self to Limit your Possibilities as a Person.
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#25

Postby Jamie514 » Mon May 15, 2017 1:48 pm

Your thinking is very good and I really liked it. Book can help you because it is best friend of all. Some special books for anger management and you must to read these.
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#26

Postby samycamara » Mon May 15, 2017 7:05 pm

I can't even imagine what you are going though.. poor thing. You are brave and haven't done anything wrong. Life isn't fair and doesn't make any promises about what kind of experience we'll have and if we'll ever feel good or the happiness we long for will ever be ours. You have so many pent up emotions that have not been dealt with. But they have been twisted into each other and have become hard to distinguish: seems like some of the emotions that have formed bonds are anger and hurt, definitely fear and guilt, and possibly pain and pleasure.

Read the book "The One Thing Holding You Back" you will never need anything more again. If you are unable to buy that then you could also google terms like radical self acceptance,
How to fully accept your emotions and read the articles that come up. I promise you in a month or two you will feel significantly better.

Growing up you didn't have the opportunity to fully feel your emotions and your fight/flight/freeze mechanism was constantly triggered. That put you in a state of hypervigilance or in other words constantly scanning your environment for danger and signs of further abuse rather than being able to relax in the moment and feel joy and comfort.. happiness always seems out of reach and saviors always disappoint. But you can get past this! There is only one way and that is to not run from your emotions but rather to fully feel them, release them and be present for the current moment with your heart open.. child like curiosity and unsolicited laugher. That can and will be yours. Hugs and love to you!
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#27

Postby Leo Volont » Tue May 16, 2017 1:39 am

samycamara wrote:
....Read the book "The One Thing Holding You Back" you will never need anything more again.



Dear Samy,

I know you mean well, but there are Books and there are books. I looked up "The One Thing Holding You Back" and found it was written by one Raphael Cushnir. the Book Vendor even gave a BIO of Mr. Cushnir, and I paste it below:

Raphael Cushnir is a leading voice in the world of emotional connection and present moment awareness. He has shared his unique approach to personal and professional development with millions of readers in O, The Oprah Magazine, Beliefnet, Spirituality and Health, Psychology Today, and The Huffington Post. He is the author of five books, lectures worldwide, and is a faculty member of the Esalen Institute, the Kripalu Center for Yoga and Health, and the Omega Institute for Holistic Studies

Well, it seems Clear enough, doesn't it? that Author is just some New Age guy -- one of those Predatory Authors I often talk about. Such books are all Feel Good Fluff. But the People who come for Help here at Anger Management have Real Problems and should be directed toward Substantial Books written by Science Based Health Care Professionals, or at least Somebody Professional. Not just some Smirking Scam Artist. Besides the book isn't even ABOUT Anger Management. Oh, and he has written 5 other books, and they are all equally about Nothing in Particular. I suppose the Women must think he is cute.
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#28

Postby quietvoice » Tue May 16, 2017 2:03 am

Don't know this author at all, but I quote a paragraph from his website, and wonder where you stand on this:
Second, when you mention that some emotions are unhealthy, I would refine your statement to read, “Prolonged resistance is unhealthy.” Unless accompanied by resistance, no emotion appears long enough, or frequently enough, to cause real harm. When we refer to people in need of “anger management,” for instance, it’s their resistance to anger that’s the actual problem. Such people usually need to stop trying to manage the experience of anger and instead, finally, just let it happen. Once they can feel their anger fully, without having to act it out upon others, it almost always passes quicker, easier, and minus any social cost. Plus, this process creates a direct through line to any core emotion that might lie beneath anger’s protective blast

From here.
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#29

Postby samycamara » Tue May 16, 2017 2:34 am

Leo, I absolutely know what you mean about new age gimmicky stuff.. it really turns me off as well.

What I really like about this author is the concept that true change can not begin unless we are first willing to accept the idea that it is okay to have that particular flaw.. or have an unlikable quality. That tricks the lower reptilian brain to back off so to speak.. reduces the pressure to change and therefore brings about room for transformation.

Also being able to relax with the negative feelings allows you to see that they don't have as much power as you initially thought. This builds emotional courage. That reduces the compulsion to act on the urges. Leo, I was blown away by the effectiveness of this process.

That being said it is equally important to use processes like CBT to strengthen the Neo-cortex so that it can better direct the amygdala instead of the other way around. However, the self acceptance is more for the limbic system that regulates emotions directly. And I do see your point about the abundance of books out there that can be bought. That is why I recommend articles on radical self acceptance and emotional acceptance that are free and quick to read.. esp if the book is not an option.
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