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Can a narcissist ever change??


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Author Thread
heatherbell
Preferred Member


Joined: 04 Jul 2007
Posts: 387

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:00 am

Can a narcissist ever change??    Reply with quote  

That's it really.....am fed up banging my head against a brick wall with this person. Three years of psychotherapy don't seem to have made a huge amount of difference to them
  
tokeless
Senior Member


Joined: 08 May 2008
Posts: 1124

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:50 am

   Reply with quote  

I think until narcissist's take a good look at themselves they will never change!

But, seriously. Psychotherapy isn't like a course of antibiotics that will treat the sufferer if they just take the pills. Perhaps this person doesn't see any incentive to change. What do they get out of the relationship that they don't get now?
theforsaken
Senior Member


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 1667

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:50 am

   Reply with quote  

have you considered that maybe this person is just an a**hole?
tokeless
Senior Member


Joined: 08 May 2008
Posts: 1124

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:52 am

   Reply with quote  

That was meant to ask what would they get out of the relationship (if they change) that they don't get now?
alrietto
Junior Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2010
Posts: 59

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:52 pm

Re: Can a narcissist ever change??    Reply with quote  

quote:
Originally posted by heatherbell
That's it really.....am fed up banging my head against a brick wall with this person. Three years of psychotherapy don't seem to have made a huge amount of difference to them


www dot questia dot com/googleScholar.qst;jsessionid=F0F1D5FFE9C5DC2FDDB859C214DED095.inst2_2b?docId=5002562046

Narcissistic personality disorder is a common and often disabling syndrome. Although persons with narcissistic personality disorder are often difficult to treat, certain psychotherapeutic strategies have been identified which can lead to effective interventions with these clients. This article presents strategies for assessing and treating narcissistic personality disorder during psychotherapy. Both theoretical and research literature is summarized in order to highlight useful approaches to working with clients manifesting narcissistic characteristics.

...

NPD has been regarded as one of the most difficult pathologies to successfully treat (Lawrence, 1987). Beck and Freeman (1990) point our that when individuals with NPD actually engage in psychotherapy, it is primarily due to the symptoms of another disorder, most commonly depression. The lack of actively pursuing treatment for this condition is symptomatic of the disorder itself; individuals esteem themselves too highly to consciously consider the need for treatment. Some clients will project their grandiosity onto the therapist and develop a love-hate relationship.

They are likely to approach therapy with a sense of entitlement and may seduce the therapist into supporting their sense of grandiosity.

findarticles dot com/p/articles/mi_hb013/is_4_5/ai_n28974030/?tag=content;col1
Ruthless Mask
Junior Member


Joined: 01 Jan 2011
Posts: 86
Location: Aust

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:24 pm

   Reply with quote  

Narcissitic behaviour is just out of control self-importance, that inflates self-esteem( more nonsense). It is a result of a belief in the thought that there is a separate self, controlling the human organism. This is completely false, see the falseness, the illusion disolves and narcissism cannot be.
Ruthless Mask
Junior Member


Joined: 01 Jan 2011
Posts: 86
Location: Aust

Post Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:26 pm

   Reply with quote  

quote:
Originally posted by theforsaken
have you considered that maybe this person is just an a**hole?


Oh very intelligent and helpful!!!
waiawy
New Member


Joined: 05 Jan 2011
Posts: 4

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:23 am

   Reply with quote  

I do think gene plays the crucial role in narcissism , so it's nearly uncurable.
It's not like software runing on a computer which you can recode , it's rather the
hardware which is unchangeable.
theforsaken
Senior Member


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 1667

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:13 am

   Reply with quote  

quote:
Originally posted by Ruthless Mask
quote:
Originally posted by theforsaken
have you considered that maybe this person is just an a**hole?


Oh very intelligent and helpful!!!
its more intelegent and helpful that telling people they dont exist as the solution to everything...
alrietto
Junior Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2010
Posts: 59

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 4:23 pm

   Reply with quote  

I have gotten some advices regarding how to deal with a Narcissist or Psychopath:

The first advice I got about how to deal with a Narcissist or Psychopath is don't deal with them. Get as far away from them as you can!

I'd like to make a comment that Narcissists and Psychopaths are very closely related. Narcissists and Psychopaths are essentially the same and the only difference is the severity of their disorder.

They are incurable! You can't change them! As they get smarter, they get worse! There is no accumulation of credit with them. Any investment in them is futile! If you help them, they return the favor by hurting you back!

The way to deal with a Narcissist or Psychopath is as follows:

1. No contact! Establishing no contact with them will prevent them from further harming you and permit the begining of your recovery.

2. You may need some therapy to recover for the trauma(s) inflicted on you by the Narcissist or Psychopath. Consider therapies such as EMDR, Guided Imagery, Guided Meditation etc...

3. Re-programming you sub-conscious mind: Using NLP or affirmations re-program yourself, for example: "She is very sick", "She has a narcissistic personality disorder", "She is miserable".... etc.

4. Get on with your life (away from her!!!). Learn new things relevant for your recovery, your profession, your career, your family, your own well being... and start practising these new skills immediately to move on and have a happy succesful life and thus forget you ever met the Narcissists.


I hope that helps.
heatherbell
Preferred Member


Joined: 04 Jul 2007
Posts: 387

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 4:43 pm

   Reply with quote  

General consensus seems to be that no, a narcissist cannot change. Confirms my own experience, but sometimes I thought my opinion may be slewed because I'm too close to the problem. Would love to get as far away as possible but it's impossible when it's a member of your own family. What to do? Really, really, really at end of my tether.
Mantis
Full Member


Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 210

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:03 pm

   Reply with quote  

curious that someone mentioned a "gene" for it?

I think both my maternal grandfather and my uncle(mother's brother) suffered from severe narcissism, or were even psychopaths.
And, according to what other relatives have told me, including my mother and grandmother, they come from a long line of people who always acted "insufferably arrogant", completely egotistical and insensitive, and over-confident.

The weird thing is my grandfather was subjected to psychological assessment, and he was declared "sane". But those who knew him in private were terrorized by him.
He threatened to kill his wife, treated her like a slave all her life, although he wasn't physically abusive.
He was impossibly arrogant, treated everybody like crap, even those who were very kind to him.

My uncle is even worse. He has been unemployed since 2001, living on his wife's money(they have no kids), and on top of the fact that she supports him, he treats her like sh**, always picking fights, not doing anything around the house, spending her money on expensive hobbies, like chess club, ping-pong classes and what not.
And everybody who knows him thinks he is a total braggart, he's always arrogant, and acts like he knows everything, and that people around him are all "idiots".
He's choleric, and it's impossible to even talk to him..it's like, no matter what you say, he twists it into what he wants to hear. And almost without exception, starts an argument on the smallest, most insignificant subjects, like the weather, for instance.
Mantis
Full Member


Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 210

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:04 pm

   Reply with quote  

P.S.

However, I am not so sure that it is indeed "genetic" or passed on from generation to generation, through upbringing.
tokeless
Senior Member


Joined: 08 May 2008
Posts: 1124

Post Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:21 pm

   Reply with quote  

Heather:
I guess the only advice I can suggest is that you, and none of us can predict or control what happens in life, but we can learn to control how we react to it.

How much contact do you have with this person. Do you live with them?

Best wishes
alrietto
Junior Member


Joined: 14 Nov 2010
Posts: 59

Post Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:00 am

   Reply with quote  

quote:
Originally posted by Mantis
... However, I am not so sure that it is indeed "genetic" or passed on from generation to generation, through upbringing.
Yes!!! Absolutely!!!

Narcissism and Psychopathy are not genetic disorders. These disorders may pass from generation to generation by learning the behaviour, by being victims and being abused during childhood.

The incapacity for empathy and real emotions towards their children is exactly what creates another generation of narcissists and psychopaths.

It is a communicable disease!!!

Stay away from them!!!

They are contageous!!!
  

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