Bottomless Void

#15

Postby TheCloud » Wed Dec 07, 2016 11:07 am

As you have ascertained for yourself, it appears that you are quite out of touch with your emotions, to the point that it is difficult to guess what is bothering you the most. So that is the exercise that I would give to you; what is bothering you the most? What trauma or difficulty or past experience do you flinch away from?
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#16

Postby winzer » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:01 am

It's difficult to say. But I guess I do feel a lack of purpose and completeness in life. I want to feel joy I just don't know how. I honestly don't know what satisfies me anymore. I'm not super sad, I just feel like an empty shell is all. I want to connect with people. Because i feel exteme lonelyness. But most relationships I find disatisfying. I also want to feel like I matter.
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#17

Postby TheCloud » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:33 pm

winzer wrote:I also want to feel like I matter.


Who was it that you were supposed to matter to the most, growing up?
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#18

Postby winzer » Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:39 am

TheCloud wrote:
winzer wrote:I also want to feel like I matter.


Who was it that you were supposed to matter to the most, growing up?


This assumes I was supposed to matter to someone growing up. Can you explain why you are asking this question?

Now I just want to feel like I matter to everyone. I want to feel like I'm valued. I want to feel that love.
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#19

Postby proudconfidentman » Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:43 am

If you always want to achieve more you aren't going to be happy. So find out what it is that gives you the feeling of always wanting to achieve more.

Is it Approval of others? Whatever it is you're not giving it to yourself. Maybe you should find a way to love yourself more.
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#20

Postby TheCloud » Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:32 pm

winzer wrote:This assumes I was supposed to matter to someone growing up. Can you explain why you are asking this question?

Now I just want to feel like I matter to everyone. I want to feel like I'm valued. I want to feel that love.


Children are born with an instinct for what is "supposed" to happen. They are supposed to have a protective figure and a nurturing figure, generally but not necessarily a father and a mother. When those roles are improperly fulfilled in a way the child can't mentally cope with positively, they develop negative compensation mechanisms. For example, they might construct a narrative where they don't need anyone who cares about them, when clearly they feel the lack. This initial trauma leads to further trauma as the child develops, resulting in a layered and complex web of negative associations.

In the broadest terms, I asked to see what your answer would be. That you have refused to answer directly indicates to me some of the difficulty you have discussing the subject of your parents and childhood, the lack of awareness you have regarding your own internal emotional experience, and something of the coping mechanisms you have in place to compensate for those difficulties. You did not entirely deflect, and are aware that you need to be valued and loved.

You are ignorant of the specifics of the narrative in your head regarding that requirement. I want to hear your narrative to completeness so that I, and more importantly you, can understand the structures you have built in your life to prevent connection with this world and the people in it. All children are born with the need to be loved and cared for, and none are born with the ability to fulfill that need on their own. So what do you have to say on the matter of your childhood? You've indicated that it was lacking. It would help to know specifics.
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#21

Postby federico91 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 9:16 pm

Emptiness is part of nature, If we observe the chemistry, we can discover that all matter is made up of atoms, atoms are formed by electrons, protons and neutrons, and atoms are mostly empty space, there is a comparison between a soccer field, and an atom , The core is represented as a tennis ball in the middle of the court, electrons like small tennis balls spinning around the court, and everything else is empty space,a vast space

It is possible to enjoy the emptiness, because its is space, free space, When we look at a room without furniture we can say that it is empty, or that it is full of space, It's a phrase that said Osho

It all depends on the perception we have,Sometimes it is difficult to achieve some goals, to achieve a strong sense of solid identity to be proud, to have achieved a great goal, But maybe it's just a quest to decorate our ego, Maybe we would have to settle for enjoying life and simple things, Listen to a good music, go for a walk, cook something delicious, meet some girl or some boy, read a good book, and enjoy, Do not take things so seriously

It is possible to experience emptiness as a sense of dissatisfaction, And in a sense it is good that it be so, Because this feeling keeps us active, looking for new things, If we were satisfied, satisfied with things as they are, we would never seek to change or improve some things

It is enough to look at the past, to observe all the things that one did, and to look for a way to improve those things, for example if in the last relationship one was jealous, try to be less jealous the next time one is in a couple

It is important to observe what are the things that make us feel happy and what are the things that make us feel sad, and look for those things that make us feel happy, without side effects, things that are achieved with effort, for example getting in shape, Toning the body, reading a book, conquering a girl or boy, falling in love with a girl or boy, getting a job,

Or help other people, enter a foundation without profit, many people find a deeper meaning in their lives when they devote part of their time to helping people in need
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#22

Postby HumanB » Sat Feb 04, 2017 2:22 am

winzer wrote:Which I guess includes, having a family, experiencing a tragedy?, meeting new people and making friends, etc. I feel like this has never happened to me.

Then what exactly ARE your 'accomplishments' that you think so highly of and talk up? Perhaps your values have been skewed and that is why you don't feel fulfilled by your 'accomplishments'?
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#23

Postby winzer » Tue Feb 14, 2017 7:43 am

TheCloud wrote:
winzer wrote:This assumes I was supposed to matter to someone growing up. Can you explain why you are asking this question?

Now I just want to feel like I matter to everyone. I want to feel like I'm valued. I want to feel that love.


Children are born with an instinct for what is "supposed" to happen. They are supposed to have a protective figure and a nurturing figure, generally but not necessarily a father and a mother. When those roles are improperly fulfilled in a way the child can't mentally cope with positively, they develop negative compensation mechanisms. For example, they might construct a narrative where they don't need anyone who cares about them, when clearly they feel the lack. This initial trauma leads to further trauma as the child develops, resulting in a layered and complex web of negative associations.

In the broadest terms, I asked to see what your answer would be. That you have refused to answer directly indicates to me some of the difficulty you have discussing the subject of your parents and childhood, the lack of awareness you have regarding your own internal emotional experience, and something of the coping mechanisms you have in place to compensate for those difficulties. You did not entirely deflect, and are aware that you need to be valued and loved.

You are ignorant of the specifics of the narrative in your head regarding that requirement. I want to hear your narrative to completeness so that I, and more importantly you, can understand the structures you have built in your life to prevent connection with this world and the people in it. All children are born with the need to be loved and cared for, and none are born with the ability to fulfill that need on their own. So what do you have to say on the matter of your childhood? You've indicated that it was lacking. It would help to know specifics.


Thanks for the explanation. The question just didn't make intuitive sense to me.

As for my childhood, my biological father left me when I was very young, around 5 or so. I haven't seen him since. Repeated attempts to contact him have gone unfulfilled and it's been rather disheartening. My mother did remarry. I'm not sure what else to include.
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#24

Postby winzer » Tue Feb 14, 2017 8:02 am

HumanB wrote:
winzer wrote:Which I guess includes, having a family, experiencing a tragedy?, meeting new people and making friends, etc. I feel like this has never happened to me.

Then what exactly ARE your 'accomplishments' that you think so highly of and talk up? Perhaps your values have been skewed and that is why you don't feel fulfilled by your 'accomplishments'?


This is a fair question.

I graduated from a near top college in science. I was published in a scientific journal as an undergraduate. I've lived in a couple countries for work and education spanning 3 years. I've worked for some fortune 50 companies. I'm in my 20's and I make a 6 figure salary and I have no debts. I'm not a materialistic person, rather I invest in the hopes of achieving financial independence and retiring early.

Of course now that I look at this, the accomplishments I've listed are academic, work, and finance related. I don't have anything to say for accomplishments in terms of relationships, spirituality, etc. and hence my reason here I guess...To be honest, I have no idea what those would even look like or how I would measure that.
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#25

Postby HumanB » Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:53 pm

Well isnt that the nub of it then? The core of what is most valuable to us humans, what is it?.... human relationships, a sense of connection, a sense of meaning or purpose, a sense of place or belonging, the experience of affection, friendship, loyalty, trust, joy, nurturing/helping another (including your own child perhaps), feeling loved and understood and wanted and useful, and adored!.... etc etc, spiritual/human things defined in those kinds of terms (you can add into that gods/religions if you are so inclined).
Either you know what those things are like because you have experienced them (and thus can assess their value TO YOU based upon how that made you feel/behave), or you've seen/heard/read about them and learned how others feel&think about those things. As for "measuring" it, I don't think one does measure it in the same way one can measure a salary, I guess it comes down to how happy/fulfilled each individual feels. A lot of people say that the most fulfilling thing in their life is being a parent. Does that need to be a precise measurement (can it ever be?), does one need to compare the sense of fulfillment from parenthood to having a happy marriage of 50years? It doesnt matter which is the 'better' accomplishment, what matters is just that you do some things that give you a deeper sense of happiness with life, all of those are valuable acheivements for a person and adds to the sense of fulfillment/meaning/connection in their life..... which ultimately is what I believe creates the feeling of happiness.
If you ask yourself the question "how could I make my life more fulfilling" does that question make enough sense that you can conceive of an answer?
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