20+ months paws

Postby Theguider » Mon Mar 13, 2017 1:41 am

Im currently at 21 months. The challenges I deal with and want to emphasize are brain fog/low concentration, and low cognition. As a student this poses serious challenges because my program involves rigorous math and physics. I began taking ADD medication, the result was better concentration for an extended period of time. However, my baseline intelligence has not fullyrecovered . To put it simply, Imagine a person with an IQ of 140-150 drop to what feels like 120-130, reasoning clearly becomes quite difficult. The ADD medication allows me to extend focus but it does not provide the ability exercise control on thought and direct it at the level I use to before paws. I call it having a " low quality of consciousness". There are other implications of this brain fog besides school, such as difficulty establishing an appropriate strategy for recovery and sticking to it. I find that another problem with paws is an awareness that something is off but not having the full mental capacity to implement a "well thoughtout" solution. So, you may want to take steps to improve your life however giving the length of recovery, that goal will seem unattainable. Additionally, social/emotional intelligence also takes a damage because you may feel slow or disconnected from your colleagues and friends. If anyone has tips on dealing with brain fog/concentration let us know. Lastly, If you're in the early stages of recovery it will get better. Just hang in there and ride it out.
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#1

Postby slick_willy » Tue Mar 14, 2017 10:47 pm

There are other implications of this brain fog besides school, such as difficulty establishing an appropriate strategy for recovery and sticking to it. I find that another problem with paws is an awareness that something is off but not having the full mental capacity to implement a "well thoughtout" solution. So, you may want to take steps to improve your life however giving the length of recovery, that goal will seem unattainable.


Developing a strategy for working toward becoming well requires very little intelligence and is much more about your discipline and common sense. Your post reads something like "I was a mega genius before, but since using drugs my IQ has dropped to where I only function on the same level as everyone else." You mention your IQ dropping from 150 to 130, and if that's true then 130 is still way above average, and working toward becoming healthy isn't hinged on your IQ anyway. You think all the top athletes, health gurus, nutritionists, or anybody else who took steps to improve their life was automatically a genius? No way bro, you need to stop feeling sorry for yourself and stop bullshitting.

I am a senior year electronics engineer student with a 4.0 gpa in all my upper division courses. I have always been considered "gifted" and tested very highly on standardized tests. But what will get you more results in life than intelligence is HARD WORK, no matter how smart you are. Read the stories of successful people and you will realize that consistent hard work is the common theme between all of them. You have to take this same attitude when it comes to school, relationships, health, your dreams, or anything you want to work toward in your life. If you keep finding excuses as to why you can't, then you will keep giving yourself evidence as to why you shouldn't even try. You will never succeed this way.

I wish you the best of luck man, let us know how things go for you.
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#2

Postby slick_willy » Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:04 pm

I also just want to say that I know rhat last post might seem harsh, but I see negativity in a lot of my classmates and it stops them from even trying the things that would heap huge rewards for them. There is always a convincing reason to not try something worthwhile, but if you let this hold you back then you will just get stuck in life, and you will be convinced that there is a good reason for you being stuck. That is the worst part. Do the best you can and you will see positive results man, and I hope to see you posting success stories on this forum someday
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#3

Postby Theguider » Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:32 am

You are projecting way too hard. I'll state this again, the point of this thread is to shed insight into brain fog/cognitive deficits post weed use, which in review of this forum I found little. The example of the IQ is in reference to a fellow at most 6 years ago on this thread who took IQ tests during this recovery period. I could have used a person with a baseline IQ of 100 that falls to what feels like 80 the argument would still be valid. First, Im not here for a D measuring contest, but to put things in perspective. Second, it is irresponsible to tell people that deal with mental challenges that the reason they can't get achieve is lack of disicipline, hard work or lack of common sense. People are here to find explanations, If a person reads this I want them to understand that over the course of recovery, they may begin to understand what they need to achieve and under normal circumstances devising and executing a plan to get there is simple for most . However during paws and all else being equal, the reality is it is difficult to achieve that goal because of underlying challenges they may have to deal with. For example if they want to loose weight, in the earlier stages of paws (0-6 months) this may seem tougher than it actually is because of anxiety/depersonalization etc. However, at say year 1 loosing weight will seem easier to achieve just as it was before pre paws. It seems trivial to say hardwork/common sense is required to loose weight. Im assuming people want useful tips to mitigate these challenges during recovery not empty platitudes and grossly inadequate actions to address a serious problem.
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#4

Postby slick_willy » Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:48 am

Just being honest homie, take it how you will. You can spend as much time as you want on online forums, looking for reasons to validate your obstacles to recovery, or you can take actual steps that will lead to positive changes in your life--it's up to you. Again, not trying to make this a D measuring contest like you said, but if there's a goal that you have then the only person who can stop you is you. It really is that simple. People overcome much larger challenges than brain fog every day, paws is not like some roadblock which makes achieving goals impossible. I am still going through it but we always have some locus of control on our environment man, we really do. I just feel it's better to focus on that than to focus on the problem, which could easily lead to overmagnifying it. My two cents man, best of luck to you on your journey.
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#5

Postby Ihceik » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:43 am

25 months off weed here. Since quitting, there have been many things that have been brought to my attention, with the main realisation being; your problems do not stop with weed. We become so fixated on our addiction to weed, we consolidate all our problems towards it as the sole reason for their existence. Then 2 years later of abstaining and you find yourself confused and frustrated because the miracle cure (quitting weed) didn't solve all the problems you have.

While it's well known PAWS includes brain fog, you realise MANY things do too. For all you know, you likely had brain fog before you smoked weed. It's so easy to romanticize our lives before weed as being "wonderdul", until the big bad plant came along and took it away. This is a fallacy we all lead ourselves to believe at the start of our quitting persuit. Here are a few things you should take into consideration.

1. The 2 year goal is just that, a goal. Its largely generalized and shouldnt be an indication of when you expect to bounce back to "normal". What takes someone 2 years to feel good, may take someone else 4. Our bodies and minds (and the abuse they received) differ from person to person, as should our expectations of returning to "normal".

2. What other damaging behaviors do you have that may contribute to how you feel? There are so many people who eat junk, don't exercise and play video games relentlessly and wonder why they don't feel good. Forever shrouded with the false belief that everything should be "wonderful" again by now.

The same goes with porn and chronic masturbation. People do not realise how destructive porn can be to your life. That, as well as the thing 3 things above are all symptoms of addiction, and with that carry the same symptoms when abused and when abstained from.

I suggest taking a closer look at your behaviors that may be causing you just as much disservice as weed. Sometimes when we magnify certain problems in our lives we lose sight of the less urgent ones. And I severely doubt your only problem in life was weed. There are definitely other issues in your life you aren't dealing with correctly or have yet to identify.
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#6

Postby Theguider » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:55 am

To preface this message. This may only apply to those with this general profile. Usage was between 1 to 3 yrs, young adult age 18 to 25, panic/anxiety induce dp. No prior history anxiety, depression, dp etc..

General Idea

Recovering from paws is a lengthy process which usually takes 2-3 yrs based on this forum. In my opinion the body can heal if you make healthy decisions and implement good coping strategies. The rest is up to time. (This is just an opinion not fact )

History
: Im 22 yrs old 6 ft 190, varsity athlete, and Im in caloric maintenance 8/12 months, surplus otherwise. Smoked weed for about a year. Two main reasons I quit, (1) The enjoyment diminished over time (2) The opp cost of smoking weed was a missed opportunity to be productive. 3 months after quitting I had a panic attack went through the hell you're going through and 21 months later most symptoms are in distant memory as my body rebalanced its self, now I have virtually zero anxiety, dp, depression, visual disturbance, etc. The brain fog/cognition is my primary concern currently. Though it has also improved when compared to even two months ago, its seems to take longest to readjust in my experience.

Caution

Tthere is no actual consensus on the existence of paws caused as a result weed withdrawal by professionals, uncommon forum seems to be the primary place to find such stories. It is difficult for me to find studies explaining why people react as we have after quitting weed( pls let us know if you do have reasearch). This does not mean there isn't an explanation, I guess we just have to be patient as more reasearch is conducted on this topic. So take what you read going forward and on this forum with a great deal of caution

Reasoning

Based on anecdotal evidence on this forum we know some unkown percentage of people recover from weed/paws sucessfully. If we accept sucess as returning to a relatively stable equilibrium maintained by physiological processes. Im not there yet but I see no clear reason thus far as to why an Individual would fall short of a "stable equilibrium" if the following conditions are met: make healthy decisions, implement coping strategies to deal with paws and accept the time it takes to heal.

Here are Tips/Advice (This is not a professional advice)
1. Ativan and melatonin for sleep in the first month. I took ativan for less than two weeks and melatonin for 2 months . (Prescribed by a physician)
2. Do not drink in the early stage (I didn't drink for 6 months)
3. Take time off work/school if you truly need it dont force your self (optional)
4. Exercise , it is a great way to regulate sleep, I train from 6-9pm when i get home im too exhausted to think about anxiety
5. Try establishing a routine, I said in an earlier post this will be hard but it gets easier with time
6. I use massage and steam therapy amongst other modalities to stay grounded which helps with the dp feeling (optional)
7. Get blood work to find out if you have deficiencies, then supplement accordingly.pls don't fall for bs online claims of magic pill there're useless
8. Reading (optional) working on my comprehensive and language skills
9. Avoid coffee for atleast 6 months
10. Try to eat healthy, keep in mind your appetite can fluctuate during paws
11. If you're on this site, yes you f'd up and up to 2 yrs or more will be lost while you're trying to recover from your haze (accepting this will be hard but you have no choice if you want to grow up )
12a.You are done with drugs permanently!
If you make it out of successfully, why put your self at risk again?
12b. If you don't have an answer you've probably accepted you're an addict, if you do have an answer then I suggest seeking professional advice.

Thanks

-theguider
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#7

Postby cleanofgreen » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:17 pm

Hi Theguider,

Good post. I think the reasons as you state that "there is no actual consensus on the existence of paws caused as a result weed withdrawal" are a few of the following.

1. When you give up weed after years of abuse you probably believe that it's not addictive and that you'll be fine in a month of troubled sleep and a few headaches.After the month to 6 weeks when PAWS kicks in you will go to the doctor and he will tell you that there is no such thing as cannabis addiction and will diagnose you with depression/anxiety, prescribing you anti-depressants and sending you on your merry way.
2. The problem with cannabis addiction and the subsequent PAWS has not become public knowledge yet, because everyone has been brain washed to believe that it's not addictive. This might have been the case 10-15 years ago but that was before breeders started producing 20%+ THC weed and ordinary people could grow as much as they could consume at home for practically free.
3. Most people addicted to weed try to stop and fail because of the horrible paws and just continue smoking for decades or until their lives fall apart or they start getting panic attacks. Weed addiction allows you to live a semi-functional life, so most can continue to abuse for ever. The people on here have either had panic attacks from weed and had to quit or there personal lives hit rock bottom and they couldn't take anymore.

I would have to come to the conclusion that the people on this forum are the first PAWS cases to come public, the rest were just classed as having depression and given medication or others dealt with it behind closed doors and told no one what they were going through. Now that a lot of countries are legalizing and the potency is gone sky high, it will probably be another few years before the general public realize how addictive potent weed really is and the hell that PAWS will be when they eventually do give it up.
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#8

Postby Imgunnabeatthis » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:21 am

^^^^^in regards to this post. Im on day 6 and to think im not even.in.wd yet scares the sh** outta me.
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#9

Postby imondayXX » Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:57 am

Theguider wrote:To preface this message. This may only apply to those with this general profile. Usage was between 1 to 3 yrs, young adult age 18 to 25, panic/anxiety induce dp. No prior history anxiety, depression, dp etc..

General Idea

Recovering from paws is a lengthy process which usually takes 2-3 yrs based on this forum. In my opinion the body can heal if you make healthy decisions and implement good coping strategies. The rest is up to time. (This is just an opinion not fact )

History
: Im 22 yrs old 6 ft 190, varsity athlete, and Im in caloric maintenance 8/12 months, surplus otherwise. Smoked weed for about a year. Two main reasons I quit, (1) The enjoyment diminished over time (2) The opp cost of smoking weed was a missed opportunity to be productive. 3 months after quitting I had a panic attack went through the hell you're going through and 21 months later most symptoms are in distant memory as my body rebalanced its self, now I have virtually zero anxiety, dp, depression, visual disturbance, etc. The brain fog/cognition is my primary concern currently. Though it has also improved when compared to even two months ago, its seems to take longest to readjust in my experience.

Caution

Tthere is no actual consensus on the existence of paws caused as a result weed withdrawal by professionals, uncommon forum seems to be the primary place to find such stories. It is difficult for me to find studies explaining why people react as we have after quitting weed( pls let us know if you do have reasearch). This does not mean there isn't an explanation, I guess we just have to be patient as more reasearch is conducted on this topic. So take what you read going forward and on this forum with a great deal of caution

Reasoning

Based on anecdotal evidence on this forum we know some unkown percentage of people recover from weed/paws sucessfully. If we accept sucess as returning to a relatively stable equilibrium maintained by physiological processes. Im not there yet but I see no clear reason thus far as to why an Individual would fall short of a "stable equilibrium" if the following conditions are met: make healthy decisions, implement coping strategies to deal with paws and accept the time it takes to heal.

Here are Tips/Advice (This is not a professional advice)
1. Ativan and melatonin for sleep in the first month. I took ativan for less than two weeks and melatonin for 2 months . (Prescribed by a physician)
2. Do not drink in the early stage (I didn't drink for 6 months)
3. Take time off work/school if you truly need it dont force your self (optional)
4. Exercise , it is a great way to regulate sleep, I train from 6-9pm when i get home im too exhausted to think about anxiety
5. Try establishing a routine, I said in an earlier post this will be hard but it gets easier with time
6. I use massage and steam therapy amongst other modalities to stay grounded which helps with the dp feeling (optional)
7. Get blood work to find out if you have deficiencies, then supplement accordingly.pls don't fall for bs online claims of magic pill there're useless
8. Reading (optional) working on my comprehensive and language skills
9. Avoid coffee for atleast 6 months
10. Try to eat healthy, keep in mind your appetite can fluctuate during paws
11. If you're on this site, yes you f'd up and up to 2 yrs or more will be lost while you're trying to recover from your haze (accepting this will be hard but you have no choice if you want to grow up )
12a.You are done with drugs permanently!
If you make it out of successfully, why put your self at risk again?
12b. If you don't have an answer you've probably accepted you're an addict, if you do have an answer then I suggest seeking professional advice.

Thanks

-theguider


This is the best post I've ever seen on this site. Thank you.
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#10

Postby natmar89 » Sun Apr 01, 2018 2:58 pm

[quote="slick_willy"]I also just want to say that I know rhat last post might seem harsh, but I see negativity in a lot of my classmates and it stops them from even trying the things that would heap huge rewards for them.



We are not your students. We are addicts. So, to lump your outlook of your work life/student relationships with our personal life-struggles is illogical.
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