Can a narcissistic person with bipolar disorder be helped?

Postby WardenEternal » Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:46 am

I've come to finally detach from this person, mostly, because of their narcissism.

It destroys everyone around them. Someone is always the punching bag, and it's been like this for years. But recently since last year, they've been going through episodes of depression followed by targeted anger, or vice versa.

Even though I've mostly detached from this person, which makes me feel a little inhumane, I still feel fear when this person talks about suicide and pleads for death. I don't want them to die, but sometimes I also think they should die. I feel as if it's better for them, because they're in constant agony, and their narcissism prevents them from receiving any kind of help, mainly because they only see that other people need fixing and control instead of themselves. I know that I'll miss that person sometimes if they actually do die, and I miss them now because of who they once were, or at least, what they partially were if this person had been trying to keep their narcissism covert as I grew up.

I don't know if seeking counselling for them is something I should do, or even can do without their narcissism screwing it up even more. I also find the thought to find help for them extremely difficult, because I have anxiety, socialphobia, and I've never even looked for help for myself before. I've grown accustomed to dealing with everything myself. I always felt like nobody else was willing to understand anyway. Because of this person, I've learned to be mistrusting/cynical and always skeptical, and have narcissistic tendencies on my own, which I'm now trying to dismantle in every scenario I'm able to recognize it in.

Long story short, can someone with bipolar disorder and narcissistic personality disorder be helped? Or is it best to just let them ride the wave until the end? (it seems so painful to re-read that last question)

They also have OCD. They hoard, and the only time they actually clean is when EVERYONE is away from them, out of the house. They hate it when people are around and they're doing something. I kind of have the same issue when I'm creating something, but that's because I always feel like I'm watched and judged for the things I do, and it completely ruins the atmosphere and hinders my skills for me. I've only met two people in my life who actually are amazed by how skilled I am, which lets me be myself.
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#1

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:41 pm

Similar to your other threads, you are focused on how you expect other people need to behave. Fair enough...but why? In other words, is this someone you are forced to live with? Generally speaking, if it is not a spouse then you have options regarding the extent and type of contact you have. Even then there are a few options to better manage the relationship.

Parents are morally obligated to take care of their child. The opposite does not necessarily hold true. Again, taking care of a parent there are options to manage the relationship without sacrificing your own well being.

I guess, for me it is unclear the nature of the perceived moral obligation you feel to modify this person.
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#2

Postby WardenEternal » Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:21 pm

I thank you for replying to this post. It's been a while since I've made it but not said a thing afterwards which I apologize for.

Similar to your other threads, you are focused on how you expect other people need to behave. Fair enough...but why?


I try bettering myself as much as I can and sometimes i feel a bit held down when my friends are more focused on just having fun in life, which they fail at to do sometimes because they dwell on things a lot and don't try to self improve, especially since one of them expects money to be a gateway to better their life in every way. I guess this is the reason as to why I want them to change a bit. This relates to the other posts, and not this one in particular.

In other words, is this someone you are forced to live with? Generally speaking, if it is not a spouse then you have options regarding the extent and type of contact you have. Even then there are a few options to better manage the relationship.


It is family that I have to live with. I'm currently working on it, but it's hard sometimes. They pull everyone in the family down along with them whenever they feel like it.

Again, taking care of a parent there are options to manage the relationship without sacrificing your own well being.


This I'm not too sure to go about. Mostly what I've been doing the past time as of this post was just ignoring pretty much everything this family member says that is hurtful. I haven't re-read my post, but I believe I said something along the lines of them saying they want to commit suicide. This is just something they say because of a bipolar episode, sometimes it's used as a threat when being narcissistic. I've come to realize it means just about nothing but more harmful words. Thinking about it, throughout the years they're finding less and less things to pick on me about. They've moved onto other family (and familial friends) to pick on.

I guess, for me it is unclear the nature of the perceived moral obligation you feel to modify this person.


This was a person I really cared about. They were fun to be around and seemed genuine at first. Around teenhood it took a turn and they've become super toxic. I'm not too sure what you mean by this, though.
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#3

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:11 am

WardenEternal wrote:This was a person I really cared about. They were fun to be around and seemed genuine at first. Around teenhood it took a turn and they've become super toxic. I'm not too sure what you mean by this, though.


You are not too sure what I mean, because I am having to guess about what is actually going on. You are intentionally vague. Instead of being clear and specific about your situation, your initial post and subsequent response leaves much room for guesswork and speculation.

Don’t get me wrong. I understand wanting to be anonymous, the fear someone will discover your posts. Regardless, that is largely an irrational fear. If you stop being vague, then it is easier to provide helpful advice.

If it is a parent there is a different dynamic, a different moral obligation or expectation than a sibling or a grandparent, an uncle, or a step parent, etc.

What I gather is you are not a legal age to move out, ie you are a minor legally bound to live with this person.

The person has modified their behavior to no longer pick on you, because they stopped getting a reaction from you. You no longer reacting was modifying your behavior, which is the right approach. If you want to change another person, you start by changing yourself.
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#4

Postby mute » Thu Sep 05, 2019 3:34 pm

coming from a narcissistic person who got lucky.
yes we can change.

1 if we somehow read enough psychology books to actually realize that we are in fact narcs
and then actually admit it.
2 when we are backed into a corner and when we finally see that theres no other way but to change.
3 when non related people continue to tell you same thing eventually you notice that the problem is not the world but its you..

so essentially when you are left with no tricks to justify your behavior to yourself then you get out of your shell and look around

I know a lot of people say that narcs are impossible to change but I belive that everyone has a key to change, you just need to find it.
every person has that handle that hook where they say enough is enough. some just take more than others.

many narcs will avoid contact with society especially those who call them out on their bs ( which is also same people who genuinely want to help them) but they are not ready
they will create circle of people who they can manipulate in order to stay in their shell forever

I got lucky because I put myself into situations where people told me im stupid... I heard them. eventualy changed

my dad
my ex wife
some other people I know are not so lucky. they have done the opposite, avoid people

learn to be around them and not give your energy to them.
aka.. be in control of your time and schedule and in control of situation. and don't let narcissist control any of that.

theres a lot more to it lol but I gotta go to work
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#5

Postby mute » Fri Sep 06, 2019 6:16 am

narcissism is not a disorder that just appears.
its an result of childhood trauma or emotionally abusive childhood.
its a defense mechanism that carries over into adulthood and grows into narcissism
childhood trauma and emotional abuse changes the brain chemistry and has physiological effects on brain as well so its not just emotional state , narcissists brain doesn't work same way as other people and the effect of that is what we call narcissistic personality disorder.

so its not that they don't want to change, to them its a natural state physically, so explaining to them that something is wrong is not effective.
its like explaining fourth dimension to a 3rd grader, they simply have no concept until they are backed into a corner which is again a very emotionally intense experience that many times has positive effect on the brain and sometimes negative.
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