New Test For Neurological Variation

#60

Postby Candid » Mon Oct 12, 2020 8:42 am

I think he's asking who he needs to tell, and how to contact them, in order to be acknowledged for the scientific breakthrough.

Nice fox story, David. Yesterday when I was sitting on the back step a smallish squirrel ran towards me on the path and kinda skidded to a halt right in front of me. I was enchanted, but I couldn't make like a statue for ever.

If the result of covid restrictions were to make wild animals tamer I'd be all for it—if not for a fear that some of my fellow humans would start knocking them on the head.
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#61

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:35 pm

Candid wrote:I think he's asking who he needs to tell, and how to contact them, in order to be acknowledged for the scientific breakthrough.


If that's the case I would recommend publishing a paper in APA.

https://www.apa.org
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#62

Postby davidbanner99@ » Mon Oct 12, 2020 6:52 pm

Richard@DecisionSkills wrote:
davidbanner99@ wrote:I came to see Asperger's research and whole approach was misunderstood and distorted.


I get that. I'm asking the question, "So what?"

How is your view of Aspergers (the understood and non-distorted view) applied?

Does it help you with your math? No. Does it help you with your cardio? No. Does it help you get a job? No. Does it help you bake a cake? No.

Does it help you feel better about yourself? I don't know.

That's what I'm asking. In your opinion, what is the value, what is the benefit you receive by using your time to shift your view on what Aspergers is or is not?

It helps a lot. I had a best friend with a similar condition who took his life some years ago. Part of his profile is a mystery to me today. It was clearly autism in his case but now I can see it wasn't classic Asperger's. He had a good attention span in the classroom and was very gifted in maths and music. Once played lead guitar on TV. However his personal communication skills were poor. No idea of boundaries so would say very silly things to strangers. He had very bad motor co-ordination and was in psychiatric therapy most of his life. Worse than me overall. So, I do feel sure cases such as this can benefit from knowledge and information. It has helped me up to a point although there are limits. To begin genuine progress, I had to believe in my neurological profile while at the same time recognising my defects. However, rejecting the idea normality is a virtue in itself. This enabled me to process information my own way. It is true I still have serious social limitations but, having said that, I don't take meds and no major anxiety. It could be much worse.
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#63

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:16 pm

davidbanner99@ wrote: To begin genuine progress, I had to believe in my neurological profile while at the same time recognising my defects. However, rejecting the idea normality is a virtue in itself. This enabled me to process information my own way.


So it's about personal growth. That makes sense. I think there can be a lot of value in challenging your own beliefs.
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#64

Postby davidbanner99@ » Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:19 pm

Candid wrote:I think he's asking who he needs to tell, and how to contact them, in order to be acknowledged for the scientific breakthrough.

Nice fox story, David. Yesterday when I was sitting on the back step a smallish squirrel ran towards me on the path and kinda skidded to a halt right in front of me. I was enchanted, but I couldn't make like a statue for ever.

If the result of covid restrictions were to make wild animals tamer I'd be all for it—if not for a fear that some of my fellow humans would start knocking them on the head.

That won't happen. How many genuinely schizoid psychologists do you know and how many recognised? Short answer, none. Sure, in other fields such as astronomy or geometry, or music there are elite performers with Schizoid Disorder. Brian Wilson, for example. Yet in neurology there appears to be nothing. Part of it is schizoid processing is weak in the area of "imagining" normality. Such people can't view themselves by association to others. Also, people who approach a subject differently and outside if a regulated framework tend to be ignored. At uni I was told what to read and how to say and write what was accepted by convention. After uni I started to really learn to analyse free from bias.
So far, a lot of my work pieces together what has already been agreed upon so I add many quotes. My own research however has never been published. It uses an altogether different approach.
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#65

Postby davidbanner99@ » Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:23 pm

Candid wrote:I think he's asking who he needs to tell, and how to contact them, in order to be acknowledged for the scientific breakthrough.

Nice fox story, David. Yesterday when I was sitting on the back step a smallish squirrel ran towards me on the path and kinda skidded to a halt right in front of me. I was enchanted, but I couldn't make like a statue for ever.

If the result of covid restrictions were to make wild animals tamer I'd be all for it—if not for a fear that some of my fellow humans would start knocking them on the head.

It was most odd. The fox looked at me seemingly with affection. I said, "Hello, how are you!" and he seemed very at ease. I will try and leave food there tonight.
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#66

Postby Candid » Tue Oct 13, 2020 6:56 am

davidbanner99@ wrote:At uni I was told what to read and how to say and write what was accepted by convention.

But were you limited to set texts? You can always read other books or scholarly articles—but of course if you have a particular axe to grind you'll be marked down for it. And good marks are what uni's all about, aren't they?

After uni I started to really learn to analyse free from bias.

If your lecturers were biased and forced that on you, they needed to be called out on it.

My own research however has never been published. It uses an altogether different approach.

Maybe leave the APA alone for now and start with the more serious-minded of the 'popular' magazines? There are plenty about psychology,including those actually read and written by psychologists. If you wanted to do that it would help if you examined the magazine's style and checked that they haven't published anything similar recently. Also look at their word count, because editors want things just to slot in, not to require a major cut. And I think you're more likely to over-egg the pudding than to write too little!
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#67

Postby davidbanner99@ » Tue Oct 13, 2020 7:41 pm

Candid wrote:
davidbanner99@ wrote:At uni I was told what to read and how to say and write what was accepted by convention.

But were you limited to set texts? You can always read other books or scholarly articles—but of course if you have a particular axe to grind you'll be marked down for it. And good marks are what uni's all about, aren't they?

After uni I started to really learn to analyse free from bias.

If your lecturers were biased and forced that on you, they needed to be called out on it.

My own research however has never been published. It uses an altogether different approach.

Maybe leave the APA alone for now and start with the more serious-minded of the 'popular' magazines? There are plenty about psychology,including those actually read and written by psychologists. If you wanted to do that it would help if you examined the magazine's style and checked that they haven't published anything similar recently. Also look at their word count, because editors want things just to slot in, not to require a major cut. And I think you're more likely to over-egg the pudding than to write too little!


Here is my latest essay. It was designed to carefully explain the fundamental principle. I have a free-plan website for the time being. I was considering mixing in my radio physics with neurology and doing posts on both. P.S. One quite famous academic read this and was intrigued.
I'll comment on the points you made later.

(THE REAL ASPERGER SYNDROME part 1)

"The first point to make is that, in these articles, we do not use the term "Asperger Syndrome", which psychiatrist Lorna Wing used to name her diagnosis in the 1980s. Although Wing named her diagnosis after the Austrian researcher Dr Hans Asperger, neither of them approached the subject of high functioning autism in the same way. Hans Asperger's approach was far more positive and, by the same token, his research ran a lot deeper into the areas of intelligence testing and genetics. Wing tended to follow the customary conventions of modern psychiatry. She viewed her patients as intellectually limited, badly adjusted and requiring rehabilitation to normality. By the same token, such a rigid evaluation of "normality" ignores the possible, wider implications of abnormality. Wing stated:
“Asperger also believed that people with his syndrome had high intelligence, but he did not cite the results of standardized intelligence tests to confirm this. As will be seen from the case histories in the Appendix, special abilities are based primarily on mechanical memory, while understanding of the underlying meaning is poor. People with the syndrome have visible deficits in common sense. ”(Lorna Wing).
This confuses the steretypical definition of "intelligence" as opposed to neurological variation in the area of information processing.In his book "Die Autistischen Psychopathen Im Kindesalter", Asperger never stated his child patients were more intelligent, "Unfortunately, the positive aspects of the autistic personality that may be useful in the future do not prevail in 'most' cases", Asperger remarked.
However, he did assert a smaller percentage revealed giftedness and unusual ability in abstract thinking:
"One gets the impression that for a normal person, distance and remoteness in relation to the outside world is a prerequisite for the ability to think abstractly." (Hans Asperger)
So, who were the real Asperger children and how could we accurately represent the real pathology the Austrian doctor researched for 10 years in Vienna?
Fewer people may be aware that Asperger called his diagnosis Autistic Psychopathy, derived from the earlier definition "Verschrobren". By the mid 1920s, the full term used to define the diagnosis was "Schizoid Autistic Avoidant Psychopathy". The term eventually applied by Asperger "Autistic Psychopathy" seems to embody the concept of a pathology of the psyche. We will refer to it henceforth as "Asperger Disorder".
All in all, this was, in pure clinical terms, a disorder that was serious enough to be associated with Schizophrenia. It needs to be fully stressed that most patients needed to be referred to a clinic and many required psychiatric support for most of their lives.
What is the common denominator or fundamental principle of Asperger Disorder?
After some years of research, the author has been led to the conclusion that Asperger Disorder differs from other autism pathologies, in as much as those affected experience significant difficulties at school. Dutch psychiatrist Van Krevelin explains:
“The psychological profile of the autistic psychopath exhibits three characteristics: Mainly in relation to his environment, he is unable to receive knowledge from others. This becomes quite clear due to poor results in the first grade. The child follows his inclinations because he cannot pay attention to the teacher's requirements. " (Van Krevelen).
All of Asperger's autistic children exhibited problematic behaviour and learning complications during childhood. Fritz F, (one of Asperger's patients) could not study in a regular school classroom because "the hectic environment around him would annoy him and prevent him from concentrating on his studies. "(Hans Asperger)
Russian professor S. Munhin noted this distinctive feature in his clinical essays and described one patient as follows:
"He went to school at the age of 7.5, but could not study there because of excessive restlessness and distraction." S.Munkhin
So, the essence of this disorder is an absolute inability to successfully process information in any environment where the system of education relies upon personal communication and social interaction. 98 per cent of people successfully develop to process most information in such a way as emotional feedback plays a pivotal part . In such a case, learning processes are a shared, mutual experience that depend upon instinctive intuition:
“The influence on a child who is brought up in a family is mainly through feelings, through the interaction of feelings of children and parents” (Hans Asperger).
From school and onwards, education becomes ever more structured by hierarchy, status, institutionalisation and norms. Yet, Asperger noted that autistic children could only be original. Their ability to be taught via mechanical processes is greatly reduced. They are generally not inclined to adopt knowledge from adults, for example, from teachers.
"And here we come to an important conclusion. The complications that mechanised teaching causes to autists, the inability to think the same way adults teach, the difficulties that learning from them occasion, the desire to derive everything only from their own perception and thinking, - even among the smartest of them, in many cases has a negative effect." (Asperger)
In attempting to identify Asperger Disorder, an absolute priority is to evaluate performance at school. The expected pattern would be one of falling far short of normal expectations, disruption and general conflict. Sometimes, it is not so straightforward. A percentage of autistic children may perform better at school as S. Muhnin has stated:
"Despite all the oddities and absurdities of their behavior, which often make them an object of ridicule by fellow practitioners and comrades, they sometimes perform reasonably well in school, reaching the 7th - 8th grade of a special school or even a state school." (S. Munhin)
Commenting on this, Asperger seemed to take the view that some of his patients didn't manifest the same severity of withdrawel from the outside world as others. Likewise, he emphasises the reality of disconnection.
“We wish to demonstrate that the significant deviation from normality is caused by an absence of a physical relationship to the world, and said disconnection explains all their anomalies.” (Hans Asperger).
If we accept the fundamental principle that children (and adults) with Asperger Disorder are not able to absorb knowledge from a teacher (where transfer of information depends upon emotional interaction), this means that they suffer from a type of sensory deprivation. Thought processing mechanisms tend to be "inward" and external communication blotted out. As Asperger noted, “They do not perceive impulses from the outside”.
The renowned psychologist and doctor Grunya Suhareva had already described these symptoms in the 1920s.
"He applies himself to school work with great effort and works patiently. With intense concentration, he pays attention to whatever the teacher is saying. He studies inconsistently. First, he will engage himself with his work for some hours, and then - in spite of a seemingly interested expression - he will drift away into himself and fail to acknowledge a question directed to him." (Grunya Suhareva).
The quotation above also helps to shed light on what was referred to earlier. Suhareva's description suggests her patient could study in a classroom to a certain degree but not all of the time.
Below is quoted a very clear example of "inward thinking". It refers to a child who was being treated for autism in Russia:
“He began to watch his father draw a house and would stand for a long time while one house was drawn, the second, the third, and so on. As soon as his father drew a window in the house, the child ran away. Very quickly he learned how to draw houses without doors and windows. "
So, the boy becomes engrossed in imitation of his father's creative artwork but, at the same time, he approaches the subject in a different way. By not painting in any windows and doors, the boy is subconsciously blocking out the outside world. The example also demonstrates how already the patient is developing "originality". In cases where the outside world is cut-off, thought processing must adapt by becoming more individualistic, as well as more abstract. This is why some individuals with Asperger Disorder develop the ability to solve complex problems, without the need for collective input. Indeed, originality of thought can go so far that an autistic person who might amaze other people with original solutions to difficult mathematical problems, yet the same individual may encounter greater difficulty trying to follow the methods taught in school.
Earlier it was stated how Hans Asperger stood out from other psychiatrists or neurologists in as much his approach was more positive. Asperger most definitely saw a connection between science and neurological deviation. Despite that, he seemed to hold the view that, in the rare cases of genius, autistic characteristics had to be mixed in with "normal" thought processes in the right proportion.
“A child's success is a consequence of the tension between two poles of opposition: what he does spontaneously and independently, and imitation of what is shown, mastering the knowledge and skills that adults already possess.” (Hans Asperger)
Many of the Austrian doctor's patients exhibited an unusual ability to find purely original answers to a particular question but it was noticed how, in these cases, there was no ability to apply this to information that already existed.
"The attainments of gifted children from this appear more original and gives them a certain charm. With less gifted children or more severely impaired patients, the answers appear rather inferior and have no value. Information drawn from random impressions does not reflect the essence of things." (Asperger)
To conclude this article, the author will add some personal interpretation:
For the most part, Hans Asperger clearly approached the subject-matter of autism from a more enlightened and scientific perspective. He sought scientific answers to some deep questions. He carefully observed the children who were placed in his clinic and kept an open mind. Whereas 98 per cent of psychiatrists were dismissive of autistic children, viewing them as intellectually limited, Asperger became aware it is not possible to measure creative potential by using standardised, relative intelligence testing. He sensed that a less rigid environment and applied psychology could encourage giftedness in areas less expected. Of course, Asperger had clearly studied German psychology and may have been influenced to research the area of processing:
"Bleuler found a unique predisposition in 3/4% of all cases. This was expressed through strange behaviour, autism and a thought processing mechanism that deviated from normality. " (Suhareva)
Asperger carried his research far enough to explore what possible teaching system might be utilized in such cases where children had reacted negatively to the classroom environment. In fact, it cannot be stressed enough that this research had a far broader scope than any conventional approach that idealised normality and strove to eliminate abnormality. In the clinic at Vienna University, all behavioural abnormalities were put into an overall perspective, while every attempt was made to study neurological implications and factors surrounding genetics.
It was observed how above average performance in some areas of application could be enabled by attempting to eliminate emotionally based interaction and creating a far less rigid environment. Teachers in the clinic were instructed not to express excessive emotion and to give instructions impersonally:
“If we formulate requirements, at first glance, like automotive machines , stereotypically in the same monotonous way as they themselves speak, then often there is a feeling that they must obey and there is no way to disobey the order.” (Asperger)
To summarise:
(1) To diagnose Asperger Disorder, careful examination of conflict and difficulties during school years must be clarified. In the former USSR, a high percentage of children ended up in the so-called "special schools for neurotics". These do not appear to have been particularly unenlightened, although worryingly anti-depressants were utilized. Today in parts of Europe and the U.S. there appears to be no structured process to identify and support Asperger children. Uncertainty and confusion over the condition led to the elimination of Asperger Syndrome as a clinical pathology, with the substitution of ASD in its place. However, the author has serious doubts as to the vagueness of the modern definition.
(2) Asperger Disorder can be "managed" successfully by the use of different teaching systems as well as a more straightforward and concise explanation of the condition. The sad fact is 80 years after the Vienna research in Austria, many people continue to struggle with undiagnosed, neurological deviations. Many children grow into adults, still believing they are stupid. The stereotype of the successful computer nerd, employed in Silicon Valley is a modern myth, proclaimed by corporations and less informed authorities.
Bearing in mind most of Lorna Wing's patients were undergoing treatment at a London clinic, the following extract will help to illustrate that a high proportion of those suffering Asperger Disorder experience an altogether different reality:
"On their arrival at psychiatric wards for adults, these patients, with good cause, are evaluated as long term sufferers of Schizophrenia. Without any positive result, attempts at active therapy are made, through insulin shock treatment and administration of anti-psychotic drugs. " (Munhin) "
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#68

Postby davidbanner99@ » Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:10 pm

Candid wrote:
davidbanner99@ wrote:At uni I was told what to read and how to say and write what was accepted by convention.

But were you limited to set texts? You can always read other books or scholarly articles—but of course if you have a particular axe to grind you'll be marked down for it. And good marks are what uni's all about, aren't they?

After uni I started to really learn to analyse free from bias.

If your lecturers were biased and forced that on you, they needed to be called out on it.

My own research however has never been published. It uses an altogether different approach.

Maybe leave the APA alone for now and start with the more serious-minded of the 'popular' magazines? There are plenty about psychology,including those actually read and written by psychologists. If you wanted to do that it would help if you examined the magazine's style and checked that they haven't published anything similar recently. Also look at their word count, because editors want things just to slot in, not to require a major cut. And I think you're more likely to over-egg the pudding than to write too little!


I think the overall point I made is that regulated education can be a trap. I recently broke off all connections with the online electronics community as I found it extremely rigid and hierarchical. These people seemed more interested in trying to be right than the actual subject. At the highest level, there were some very advanced members but I discovered they somehow couldn't go in any other direction. It was like a need to follow an already trodden path to perfection. The worst of it was members preferred to "fit in" by agreeing with whatever was stated by their chosen leader. Another gripe was that stuff was thrown at me as copy and pasted from Google. Then passed off as an original response. All in all there was a mentality that to make questions and seek answers is a sign of somehow being a novice. I always hold the view that finding a good question is 50 per cent if the battle to understanding. Truth is too, I keep learning far more in solitude at home. Especially given the fact I tend to do better with theory than practical applied.

"It was he who abolished that small, pedantic, narrow-grooved school teaching which made of an aspiring student a galley-slave, and he who allowed freedom in the choice of subject of study according to one's pleasure and inclination, and so facilitated development." Nikola Tesla
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#69

Postby Candid » Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:36 am

Who is this essay FOR, David? It's not written for an academic journal. The most obvious breach is in the citations, which should be (Asperger, [year], [page]) and then references at the bottom in APA style https://guides.libraries.psu.edu/apaquickguide/intext, if that's where you're going with it. And if it's intended for a 'popular' journal there'd be mention of these experts and brief paraphrases, but not big quoted chunks or citations.

davidbanner99@ wrote:Hans Asperger's [...] research ran a lot deeper into the areas of intelligence testing and genetics. Wing [...] viewed her patients as intellectually limited, badly adjusted and requiring rehabilitation to normality.
Dutch psychiatrist Van Krevelin explains: “[...] The child follows his inclinations because he cannot pay attention to the teacher's requirements. "
Russian professor S. Munhin [...] has stated: "Despite all the oddities and absurdities of their behavior...]
The renowned psychologist and doctor Grunya Suhareva "[...]First, he will engage himself with his work for some hours, and then [...] he will drift away into himself and fail to acknowledge a question directed to him

And all of them are right, right? Do you believe that if all of them studied the same patient, their opinions (and biases) would converge?

I've enjoyed this essay more than any of your other posts, with my own bias, because much of it applies to my husband. When I met him he had long been diagnosed schizophrenic, and medicated accordingly while inpatient but naturally stopped taking anti-psychotics when he was able to choose. He seemed then to use the wrong diagnosis as a shield for his oddness.

It was I who hit on aspergers (or high-functioning autism), and that wasn't until we'd been married a few years and he was in his early 40s. This was not official until he mentioned aspergers to a psychiatrist and was tested for it. He came out with flying colours, if that's the phrase I want:
“significant deviation from normality is caused by an absence of a physical relationship to the world, and said disconnection explains all their anomalies.”
"he will engage himself with his work for some hours, and then - in spite of a seemingly interested expression - he will drift away into himself and fail to acknowledge a question directed to him"
“he approaches the subject in a different way. By not painting in any windows and doors, the boy is subconsciously blocking out the outside world." AND "might amaze other people with original solutions to difficult mathematical problems, yet the same individual may encounter greater difficulty trying to follow the methods taught in school."

Yep, all of that and more. And while we're on the subject, what do you make of the fact that very many more males than females are on the autism spectrum?

If we accept the fundamental principle that children (and adults) with Asperger Disorder are not able to absorb knowledge from a teacher (where transfer of information depends upon emotional interaction), this means that they suffer from a type of sensory deprivation. Thought processing mechanisms tend to be "inward" and external communication blotted out. As Asperger noted, “They do not perceive impulses from the outside”.

I think this is yours? It sounds right to me, but it's a bit of a leap from "external communication" (didactic?) to "impulses" (sensory input?). There's good reason for Husband's inability to hold a job (he's been his own boss all his life) but when it comes to physical sensation such as temperature and pain, he's much more sensitive than I am. Perhaps I've misunderstood.

Please excuse my lay interest in this subject. Pandemic "guidelines" in force for who knows how long have left me highly dependent on Husband for physical company, and I'm nowhere near as comfortable with virtual meet-ups as he is. He spends most of his days away from home while I spent most of mine in my bedroom/study. We hold evenings sacred, but I'm increasingly enraged by his incessant leg-jiggling while seated. I can halt it (in various ways) but it starts up again in seconds. What's THAT about, I wonder?

Hans Asperger [...] became aware it is not possible to measure creative potential by using standardised, relative intelligence testing. He sensed that a less rigid environment and applied psychology could encourage giftedness in areas less expected.

That's the truth. However, people on the autism spectrum don't wear badges declaring the fact, and it can't be expected that all neurotypicals will have researched the subject. Husband annoys people, to put it mildly, and living with him has driven a few of my friends away. More often people request that I see them without him, and I have to tell him that.
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#70

Postby davidbanner99@ » Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:54 pm

Candid wrote:Who is this essay FOR, David? It's not written for an academic journal. The most obvious breach is in the citations, which should be (Asperger, [year], [page]) and then references at the bottom in APA style https://guides.libraries.psu.edu/apaquickguide/intext, if that's where you're going with it. And if it's intended for a 'popular' journal there'd be mention of these experts and brief paraphrases, but not big quoted chunks or citations.

davidbanner99@ wrote:Hans Asperger's [...] research ran a lot deeper into the areas of intelligence testing and genetics. Wing [...] viewed her patients as intellectually limited, badly adjusted and requiring rehabilitation to normality.
Dutch psychiatrist Van Krevelin explains: “[...] The child follows his inclinations because he cannot pay attention to the teacher's requirements. "
Russian professor S. Munhin [...] has stated: "Despite all the oddities and absurdities of their behavior...]
The renowned psychologist and doctor Grunya Suhareva "[...]First, he will engage himself with his work for some hours, and then [...] he will drift away into himself and fail to acknowledge a question directed to him

And all of them are right, right? Do you believe that if all of them studied the same patient, their opinions (and biases) would converge?

I've enjoyed this essay more than any of your other posts, with my own bias, because much of it applies to my husband. When I met him he had long been diagnosed schizophrenic, and medicated accordingly while inpatient but naturally stopped taking anti-psychotics when he was able to choose. He seemed then to use the wrong diagnosis as a shield for his oddness.

It was I who hit on aspergers (or high-functioning autism), and that wasn't until we'd been married a few years and he was in his early 40s. This was not official until he mentioned aspergers to a psychiatrist and was tested for it. He came out with flying colours, if that's the phrase I want:
“significant deviation from normality is caused by an absence of a physical relationship to the world, and said disconnection explains all their anomalies.”
"he will engage himself with his work for some hours, and then - in spite of a seemingly interested expression - he will drift away into himself and fail to acknowledge a question directed to him"
“he approaches the subject in a different way. By not painting in any windows and doors, the boy is subconsciously blocking out the outside world." AND "might amaze other people with original solutions to difficult mathematical problems, yet the same individual may encounter greater difficulty trying to follow the methods taught in school."

Yep, all of that and more. And while we're on the subject, what do you make of the fact that very many more males than females are on the autism spectrum?

If we accept the fundamental principle that children (and adults) with Asperger Disorder are not able to absorb knowledge from a teacher (where transfer of information depends upon emotional interaction), this means that they suffer from a type of sensory deprivation. Thought processing mechanisms tend to be "inward" and external communication blotted out. As Asperger noted, “They do not perceive impulses from the outside”.

I think this is yours? It sounds right to me, but it's a bit of a leap from "external communication" (didactic?) to "impulses" (sensory input?). There's good reason for Husband's inability to hold a job (he's been his own boss all his life) but when it comes to physical sensation such as temperature and pain, he's much more sensitive than I am. Perhaps I've misunderstood.

Please excuse my lay interest in this subject. Pandemic "guidelines" in force for who knows how long have left me highly dependent on Husband for physical company, and I'm nowhere near as comfortable with virtual meet-ups as he is. He spends most of his days away from home while I spent most of mine in my bedroom/study. We hold evenings sacred, but I'm increasingly enraged by his incessant leg-jiggling while seated. I can halt it (in various ways) but it starts up again in seconds. What's THAT about, I wonder?

Hans Asperger [...] became aware it is not possible to measure creative potential by using standardised, relative intelligence testing. He sensed that a less rigid environment and applied psychology could encourage giftedness in areas less expected.

That's the truth. However, people on the autism spectrum don't wear badges declaring the fact, and it can't be expected that all neurotypicals will have researched the subject. Husband annoys people, to put it mildly, and living with him has driven a few of my friends away. More often people request that I see them without him, and I have to tell him that.

Well, this writing style of mine I guess is Asperger in practice. Doing something your own way and not following convention. Of course it was written for my Wordpress blog and all the Asperger quotes are from a Russian translation of Asperger's texts. I had been very confused about Wordpress and finally conclude the free plan I use can be accessed by other Wordpress users. I can always upgrade later.
I think it reads quite clearly and flows smoothly. The big point I make is that the cornerstone to Asperger Disorder is inability to learn in school as Van Krevelin stressed. I know this to be true as it happened to me. At school I could read very well but couldn't sit and listen in a class. I lose concentration and go inwards to daydreaming. When I look at a patient biography I look first at the school situation. Then you find all the other symptoms will be there because they interact. And the key to treating the dusorder is to recognise a whole new system of teaching must replace the usual one. If not, the person affected will fail to develop. In the case of giftedness, there could be a very lopsided development.
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#71

Postby davidbanner99@ » Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:35 pm

"It was I who hit on aspergers (or high-functioning autism), and that wasn't until we'd been married a few years and he was in his early 40s. This was not official until he mentioned aspergers to a psychiatrist and was tested for it. He came out with flying colours, if that's the phrase I want:"

HFA I believe was derived from Leo Kanner's study of autistic children and was more popular than Asperger's work. I never quite understood the idea Kanner's patients weren't the same as Asperger's. I relate to Early Childhood Autism just the same.
Asperger's definition of his patients seemed to be broad so even children with encephalitis were included. There was no "syndrome" and I think the real interest was focused on intelligence testing. Those kids who were unteachable but mathematically gifted interested Asperger. Whereas today the whole emphasis is on the behavioural abnormalities. Plus, I find myself I'm a far slower learner than average except in music. Yet being a slow learner doesn't equate to being a poor learner. I find it can take months to learn something new but then it seems to go in deeper. This is why I say with autism conditions the whole information processing aspect is 180 degrees off normal. Plus it seems to be in non practical areas with no thought to any solid purpose.
I did know one female with the symptoms. She was an artist and very tomboyish. Often talked to imaginary friends. Very gifted in art and geology but totally unemployable. She did odd jobs for friends to make a living.
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#72

Postby Tyto » Wed Oct 14, 2020 11:21 pm

Candid wrote:We hold evenings sacred, but I'm increasingly enraged by his incessant leg-jiggling while seated. I can halt it (in various ways) but it starts up again in seconds. What's THAT about, I wonder?


My autism correspondent calls this 'stimming'. I'm guilty of doing this when I'm stressed, bored, or overloaded. I do exactly the same thing your husband does, and it infuriates others.
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#73

Postby Candid » Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:48 pm

davidbanner99@ wrote:Those kids who were unteachable but mathematically gifted interested Asperger.

I've got one of those. Give him a date and he knows what day of the week it fell/will fall on. Can be handy, although the effect of that has been to diminish my mathematical skills, which weren't strong to begin with. Why would anyone 'work it out' if they had a calculator? What I don't understand, with his extraordinary memory, is why he is (as you say) "unteachable".

I find it can take months to learn something new but then it seems to go in deeper.

By which you mean, I presume, that it doesn't vanish with disuse. That would be handy.

Very gifted [...] but totally unemployable.

Tell me about it!

And that reminds me: do you take absolutely everything literally?
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#74

Postby davidbanner99@ » Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:57 pm

"Why would anyone 'work it out' if they had a calculator? What I don't understand, with his extraordinary memory, is why he is (as you say) "unteachable"."

Recently I spent hours trying to work out F.J.Camm's calculations to make a home-made analogue voltage, current and ohms tester. This was 1940s design. I ran his maths through for hours and the figures weren't working. Likewise his overall explanations were a bit vague to me. Finally I cracked it. His main base digit must have been a typo. After that, all his calculations worked fine. Use and purpose? Well, it will develop my calculating ability and, in a strange way, it adds to Camm's book. After all, F. J. Camm edited TV and radio engineering magazines in the 1940s and I managed to develop some of his ideas.
Employment wise it is useless.
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