conscious self sabotage

Postby mute » Mon Jan 11, 2021 5:16 am

why does it happen?
why would you continue to do so if you are aware of sabotage and know when its happening

yet i cant prevent it

its like i have no control over it and just watch it happen and wait it out every time ...

if self sabotage serves a purposei cant seem to find it within.
assuming that its also part of self sabotage lol
how do i even stop this if its an infinite loop of self sabotage
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#1

Postby Candid » Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:16 am

I believe it's about self-love, or rather the lack of it.
Self-sabotage means self-punishment. If you truly love yourself you'll stop doing it.
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#2

Postby mute » Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:16 am

is there another term for this?
google doesnt show any results for conscious self sabotage
onlygeneral self sabotage
to me it seems illogical for one to continue self sabotage when you are aware of it
and yet it is happening still and all i can do is watch it happen
i cant afford to go to a psychologist at the moment(not in a long time actually) so im attempting to figure out on my own


i tried to think abotu what would cause this behavior but its just not popping upin my head

because logically it makes no sense

i sabotage myself when im on the right track to improve my life financially or any other way
and then i completely **** it up while being well aware of what im doing will cost me but i dont know why i continue doing so.
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#3

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:51 pm

mute wrote:is there another term for this?


Everyone "self-sabotages". Look at the very simple example of weight loss. Look at the epidemic of obesity. Even though people know the solution, they keep repeating the same patterns. They lose some weight, but then put it all back on if not more. Why?

Self-handicapping is one reason.

Self-handicapping is a term used by researchers to discuss how people "sabotage" their own performance. You can read plenty of articles on the topic if you go to "Google Scholar".

And you might want to look into "goal commitment". One reason we self-sabotage is we begin striving for a goal full of commitment. As we get closer to achieving a goal sometimes we lose focus, we lessen our goal commitment.
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#4

Postby Candid » Thu Jan 14, 2021 2:21 pm

mute wrote:google doesnt show any results for conscious self sabotage
onlygeneral self sabotage

What do you think is the difference between these two?

to me it seems illogical for one to continue self sabotage when you are aware of it
and yet it is happening still...

But it ISN'T happening TO you. It's something you're consciously choosing to do.

because logically it makes no sense

A flashback-inducing inner critic is typically spawned in a danger-laden childhood home.
~ http://pete-walker.com/shrinkingInnerCritic.htm

i dont know why i continue doing so.

I seem to remember we've been here before, mute: me recommending Pete Walker's work and you doing everything you can to ignore the elephant in the room.

I did the same, for almost 10 years after a counsellor told me my relationship with my mother was at the root of my malaise. I didn't want to believe it. No one does.

Finally when I was 35 I was in a room with my mother for a showdown I wish I could have avoided. It was so horrific that my hair turned completely white within a matter of weeks.

I hope and believe you can do better.
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#5

Postby mute » Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:57 am

i remember reading something but i think it was another article
im checking this one now

i also believe it is something to do with my mother but my memory is very faded and i have a complete blackout for about 3 years of my childhood...
her almost dying of suicide attempt but i cannot tell if that might have been the setting point or something else entirely unrelated...

if i was to talk about energetic level ( im sure not everyone believes in that) i would say that her attempt at taking her own life exhausted her own energy and turned me and my dad into life support for her for the later years and she might have manipulated us and drained our energy while at the same time blaming us for being energy vampires every chance she gets and manipulating us in many other ways as well especially with guilt and fear of her dying (aka. watch im gonna die and yall gonna live with guilt...)


by American standards they were batshit crazy all the time
but by European standards they were a normal European family that spends free tine fighting and then have evening tea together and talk about current events...


i did cut her off few weeks ago and she reacted just as i expected with alot of anger and drama.
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#6

Postby Candid » Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:55 am

mute wrote:i did cut her off few weeks ago and she reacted just as i expected with alot of anger and drama.

If you'd TRULY cut her off, you wouldn't have known about the drama.

There's "low contact" in which you attempt to set boundaries;
and, if that fails, there's "NO contact" in which you don't accept calls or letters, and you ask other people not to carry messages from her or tell you anything about her.

It isn't easy. It's a drastic, last-resort decision and marks the first step in claiming your selfhood. From what you've said, you're long past the breached boundaries stage.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog ... -your-life may have some helpful suggestions.

If you want to talk it out with people who've been through similar, you may prefer https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditForGrown ... nt_out_of/
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#7

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:34 pm

mute wrote: i sabotage myself when im on the right track to improve my life financially or any other way
and then i completely **** it up while being well aware of what im doing will cost me but i dont know why i continue doing so....


Your mother is to blame?

Maybe part of your self-sabotage is that when you begin to "completely **** it up" you turn towards scapegoating another person, e.g. mom.
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#8

Postby Wave » Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:33 pm

Richard@DecisionSkills wrote:Maybe part of your self-sabotage is that when you begin to "completely **** it up" you turn towards scapegoating another person, e.g. mom.


There is no where enough information for your to make that conclusion, putting "maybe" in front of this doesn't change anything. I assume you also don't have any experience of a toxic family but yet you are an expert?

You seem determined to call people out while there are in the middle of a specific difficulty, can you refer me to the cognitive strategy that says this will help?
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#9

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:48 pm

Hi Wave, thanks for contributing your opinion.

Cognitive dissonance. Read up on it.
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#10

Postby mute » Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:45 am

i only recently realized how long my mother has been guilt tripping me and my dad
and she still does to him
but i am trying to keep that away from me

i do understand what cognitive dissonance is but what do i do with that?
im aware of the feeling that i have conflicting beliefs that are deeply engrained in me problem is i cant figure out what they are exactly

and feel like that is part of self sabotage since by resolving those conflicts i would be more successful

so fixing my mindset will allow me to be better which is being sabotaged
becoming wealthy will also put me into a better position and that as well is part of self sabotage im experiencing

are there psychologists who specifically work with dissonance and self sabotage? how can i find one?
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#11

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:18 pm

mute wrote:i do understand what cognitive dissonance is but what do i do with that?
im aware of the feeling that i have conflicting beliefs that are deeply engrained in me problem is i cant figure out what they are exactly

and feel like that is part of self sabotage since by resolving those conflicts i would be more successful

so fixing my mindset will allow me to be better which is being sabotaged
becoming wealthy will also put me into a better position and that as well is part of self sabotage im experiencing


Yes. People self-sabotage by failing to resolve beliefs that are holding them back from achieving their goals.

An example is someone that has a goal to be wealthy, to have financial success. In order for this to occur in a free market, the person must believe that they have a product, service, or idea that can be exchanged for wealth.

At the same time, the person might wish to believe a parent uses guilt to stop them from achieving their goal of obtaining wealth.

Notice, these two beliefs are not entirely incompatible. An adult child might decide to open a strip club, sell drugs, become a hooker, or invest in bitcoin. Parents might not approve of those ways to gain wealth. How might the parent stop the adult child? They can't use physical force. They can only use the tool of "guilt".

But, if the adult child later says, "I am not financially successful, because my parents used guilt," is that actually a true statement? In my opinion, it is an excuse. The adult child is scapegoating his or her parents. The adult child is incorrectly blaming his or her parents for failing to become wealthy. The parents could not actually stop the adult child. It is a form of self-sabotage.

Guilt can come in various forms. Parents might say, "Becoming a hooker is immoral, you should feel shame for such an idea." Or maybe the parents say, "You cannot become a sex worker, because I am in bad health and need you to stay here and take care of me."

So the adult child does not become a hooker and then later says, "My parent is to blame for me not finding financial success. My parent used guilt to stop me." Again, I say this is self-sabotage. It is scapegoating the parent, using the parent as the excuse.

Let's say the adult child then says, "Okay mom, you don't want me to be a hooker. Then I will open up a bakery to make money." But the mother says, "I need you at home. You can't leave your poor mother and go work all day in a shop baking bread." It is the tool of guilt. But is it really fair to say it is the fault of the mother that the adult child is unable to open a bakery to generate wealth? In my opinion...NO! It is an excuse.

An adult child can use the "guilt" excuse of a parent again and again and again. They can blame all of their struggles, all of their failures in life to the parent. They never recognize that the parent is not to blame. They remain an adult child, trapped by their belief that the parent is at fault.
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#12

Postby Candid » Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:40 am

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