A Few Words On Censorship

#960

Postby tokeless » Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:02 pm

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanc ... 40-6736(21)01609-3/fulltext

If link doesn't work, copy and paste it?
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#961

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:12 am

Nope, still doesn’t work. Odd. I doubt it’s because of my location. I tried two different browsers and I tried turning on my VPN.

Anyway…as always, good discussion. It’s interesting to hear your take on things.
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#962

Postby tokeless » Wed Jan 12, 2022 6:01 am

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#963

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 1:40 pm

tokeless wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/jan/12/youtube-is-major-conduit-of-fake-news-factcheckers-say

Well, ain't that a surprise?


Maybe this is the next discussion? Lol.

I’m not surprised that YouTube is censoring content. I’m also not surprised people are using “fact checkers” to justify censorship of content they don’t agree with.

The new trick by the media and social platforms is to spend money on “independent fact checkers”. That way, when brought before congress Big Tech says, “It wasn’t us, it was the independent fact checkers that labeled your content as fake.”

And people actually buy that these fact checkers are legit. It works as people actually say to each other that X or Y is true or false because it was “fact checked”. Better yet is when a fact checker labels something “partially” true or false and then gives their massaged opinion to fit whatever will keep them employed.

If someone wants to create a video that the earth is actually a triangle, no one cares. But, create a video about a controversial political topic, then it’s “disinformation” that will kill grandma and thousands of others if they are allowed to watch it and develop their own opinion. If we don’t censor the video, democracy will collapse!

I’m for less censorship, not more. But, I’m not blind to the problem. Media is extremely powerful and can legitimately have a major impact on our beliefs and therefore our actions. Look at yesterday and the social activist organization promoting Latinx. Shouldn’t we censor that offensive, racist organization for their attacks on the Latin culture?
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#964

Postby tokeless » Wed Jan 12, 2022 6:37 pm

I think we live in a media saturation world for most of us now. It's a prime and fertile environment for misinformation. There's an interesting documentary called Hypernormalisation, which covers a lot of this. The basis is that in a world of information saturation we end up not being able to believe anything with certainty because there are other versions of 'the truth'. Trump utilised it by using Fake news statements time and again, thus casting doubt on anything he didn't agree with.
I don't believe in censorship either but when did what we think matter? The media is very powerful in this age, but they don't report news anymore, they 'create' it.
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#965

Postby tokeless » Wed Jan 12, 2022 6:40 pm

I forgot to add. When we become unsure of what to believe, we become more apathetic and just disengage from thinking about it... very useful to less scrupulous governments.
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#966

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:05 pm

tokeless wrote:The media is very powerful in this age, but they don't report news anymore, they 'create' it.


Agreed. It’s very much agenda driven, created to amp up emotion, to get views that support a revenue stream through advertising.

tokeless wrote: Trump utilised it by using Fake news statements time and again, thus casting doubt on anything he didn't agree with.


So Trump points out the very observation you made…see your first quote…and he is somehow wrong for doing so?

The news, as you pointed out, is very powerful and “creates” it. What term was Trump supposed to use? The misleading news? The biased news? The creative news?

That he called out the news, that he didn’t try to appease the news and play the game on their terms like all the other politicians and his predecessors, you take issue with it? How would you deal with news repeatedly taking what you say out of context and spinning up a story?

I’m glad that few people trust the news anymore. That’s not Trumps fault. You give him too much credit.
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#967

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 8:15 pm

Another great resource for anyone interested…

https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/a ... to-quit-it

From the link:

What are the symptoms of caffeine withdrawal?

Headaches.
Tiredness.
Difficulty concentrating.
Nausea.
Muscle pain.
Irritability.

Symptoms of withdrawal begin 12 to 24 hours after the last caffeine intake and can last two to nine days.
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#968

Postby tokeless » Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:02 pm

So Trump points out the very observation you made…see your first quote…and he is somehow wrong for doing so?

That doesn't mean I agree with him or it. It's a technique to dismiss criticism by claiming you're a victim of the media... so, he calls it fake news. His followers take what he says as fact and spread it. Qanon was similar in that it had no basis in truth, but it incorporated itself in to the zeitgeist and spread around the world before suddenly disappearing in terms of further posts after September 2008. Who was Qanon? It could have been Bannon or someone else who picked their moment, but you can guarantee someone made money from it... lots of it.
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#969

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:19 pm

tokeless wrote: His followers take what he says as fact and spread it.


And who’s fault is that? If the news “creates” as we say, instead of reports, then are they not the ones responsible for the situation? If the story is fake, ie the story is biased, misleading, and taken out of context, who is to blame? The person that defends themselves against the very powerful media?

If the news didn’t try so hard to spin and fabricate and “create” then what ammunition would Trump have? Nothing. He would not have been able to use the media to such an extent, right?

Qanon was similar in that it had no basis in truth, but it incorporated itself in to the zeitgeist and spread around the world before suddenly disappearing in terms of further posts after September 2008. Who was Qanon? It could have been Bannon or someone else who picked their moment, but you can guarantee someone made money from it... lots of it.


Agreed, someone is profiting. But, I’m not sure who. Maybe the Clintons? It’s such a mysterious, in the shadows idea that is only drug out by one political party to try and bludgeon their opponents. So who is profiting exactly?
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#970

Postby tokeless » Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:34 pm

Trump is a narcissist Richard. He lives his life through entitlement and basically conning. He lies like breathing, a natural and involuntary action to him, based purely on getting what he wants. I read that he never actually wanted to win the election he did, based on the belief the runner up doesn't get investigated or scrutinised. He just wanted to make money to clear his debts.... he involved himself with some dodgy deals thinking nobody would look if he never won... he did, then they looked and are still looking. The biggest mistake he made in my opinion was to orchestrate that riot, ut the narcissist couldn't accept he lost. Now his enemies want him and they will get him, it's just a matter of time.
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#971

Postby Richard@DecisionSkills » Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:55 pm

tokeless wrote:Trump is a narcissist Richard.


And so are the Bushes, as well as Hillary, Obama, and Biden, and 90% of the politicians in office. I give Bill a pass, but he has other mental issues. So what?

Literally the 2016 election was between narcissist #1 or narcissist #2. And the 2020 was a narcissist vs. a man suffering cognitive decline. The people chose narcissist #2 in 2016 and cognitive decline over narcissism in 2020.
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#972

Postby davidbanner99@ » Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:35 pm

Seems I was right. As negotiations between Russia and NATO fail to agree, the military response by Russia would be replacement of missiles in Cuba as well as Venezuela. So the comparison to "another Cuban crisis" had a double meaning. One refers to Ukraine as posing a similar threat to Russia but also the idea of Cuba once more hosting missiles. Presumably this time round, instead of silos (which were spotted by photographs in 1961), the platform would be naval ships in the region. These would carry the Zircon hypersonic missiles. I suppose the question for the US is, is it worth it? Why escalate over the E.U.? Maybe Germany is simply using NATO as a convenience to create a fascist Europe. Maybe if Trump was in power he'd see the wisdom of self interest over getting bogged down policing Europe. Added to that Germany created past instability in Europe not Russia. Having lost some 20 million in WW2 Russia doesn't want to be under renewed threat.
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#973

Postby davidbanner99@ » Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:00 pm

I made the guess last week that Russia would adopt that policy. It's probable it was negotiated weeks, or even months ago. From Putin's perspective, a missile base in Cuba and Venezuela places the U.S. in the same danger as Russia (given there are plans to militarise Ukraine). However, as the last Cuban crisis in 1962 showed, panic can't be controlled once it's let out of the bag. What would happen if Americans wake up to news of missiles just five minutes away? Personally I think it would lead to clashes between Trump isolation supporters and the Biden administration. I mean, already there's deep unrest over the vaccine po!icies.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sDPPcwbEGcI
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#974

Postby Candid » Fri Jan 14, 2022 10:18 am

A few MORE words on censorship, this time in beleagured Melbourne, China. https://www.rebelnews.com/let_avi_report_petition
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